TornadoHorse Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Being a contest like this, it is only fair if all people participating can see other entries. We're trying to keep a level playing field, but allow those who already started to not have to start over. Slide did all the work getting the lobby set up, as well as the contest. He is in charge of it, and was the one to set the rules for now. As he said, there will be more in the future, with different rules, that will accommodate other design types. I know of a couple, if not more people who have switched to working with their designs in single player rather than on the server as they have more freedom with the amount they can world edit to avoid causing lag for other players. If they finish theirs in single player without seeing this announcement, do their designs simply not count in the voting? What will happen there? Again, that's not answering the question that was asked. It makes no difference who is running it or who made the decision. The question was why was it decided so that spawn has to be in the center, could we have an answer for this question? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slide Posted January 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 He asked for the reason for the decision, not the person responsible for the decision. The reason is because that's the way, uh huh, uh huh, i like it. https://github.com/ZachBora/PlotMe/blob/master/src/com/worldcretornica/plotme/PMCommand.java#L1912 Thanks, i'll re-enable it. Though it does seem to be weeding out the people who are too lazy to read any of the rules. If you don't mind, could I ask your reasoning for such a small time frame? The contest goes until next month, why make the deadline for imports so soon? The reason is I want all designs/work in one place, for the designs to be done inside the community, rather than alone in secret. I've tried to enable as many features as possible so it shouldn't be a question about tools. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barneygale Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 I don't mean to sound rude slide, but it's a very simple question and I have no idea why you can't give a simple answer. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slide Posted January 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 I don't understand. If you're trying to keep it level, why give people such different times? Even so, this is still really early, I know a few people that are building their hubs locally due to the WorldEdit restrictions on the Event server, I feel it's unfair to force those people to rush their build. No rule or announcement before the event stated we even will accept schematics. I believe I've posted twice on the issue, the first stating 'a few days from contest start' which is essentially now, and now I've said until Wednesday which just gives the people who didn't see the first announcement more time. They are also able to have their builds imported by Wednesday and finish building on the server. This is a concession made to not leave out the people who started early. I know of a couple, if not more people who have switched to working with their designs in single player rather than on the server as they have more freedom with the amount they can world edit to avoid causing lag for other players. If they finish theirs in single player without seeing this announcement, do their designs simply not count in the voting? What will happen there? Again, that's not answering the question that was asked. It makes no difference who is running it or who made the decision. The question was why was it decided so that spawn has to be in the center, could we have an answer for this question? At no point was it stated that entries could be submitted outside the event server so I'm not sure why they would expect to be able to As for the center being the spawn, see below. I don't mean to sound rude slide, but it's a very simple question and I have no idea why you can't give a simple answer. That is the answer, because that is how I want it. There is no technical reason, a decision had to be made and I decided to go with how I wanted it. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Four_Down Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 The reason is I want all designs/work in one place, for the designs to be done inside the community, rather than alone in secret. I've tried to enable as many features as possible so it shouldn't be a question about tools. So, builds that are not on Nerd have to be submitted within 4 days purely because that's how you want it? I think that's ridiculous. If you're so set on having them in one place, why not allow them to submit one week before the deadline, that gives plenty of time for people to finish their builds, as well as people to view the builds. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denevien Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 So, builds that are not on Nerd have to be submitted within 4 days purely because that's how you want it? I think that's ridiculous. If you're so set on having them in one place, why not allow them to submit one week before the deadline, that gives plenty of time for people to finish their builds, as well as people to view the builds. They don't have to be complete. We are allowing players to submit their work in progress, and finish on Event. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiderMan Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 (edited) I don't mean to sound rude slide, but it's a very simple question and I have no idea why you can't give a simple answer. He literally said: The reason is because that's the way, uh huh, uh huh, i like it. -gsand ;D Edited January 20, 2014 by gsand 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TornadoHorse Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 They don't have to be complete. We are allowing players to submit their work in progress, and finish on Event. What's the reason for this? I think it's totally fair to want everyone's builds to be in the same place, but as Four_Down said why not just allow them to be pasted in at the end? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denevien Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 What's the reason for this? I think it's totally fair to want everyone's builds to be in the same place, but as Four_Down said why not just allow them to be pasted in at the end? It allows all players the chance to see the competition. It would be unfair for those who don't have access to World Edit outside of Event to have to build it in game for everyone to see, but not get to see what they're up against. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiderMan Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 erdtszacks lobby design is the best! just sayin' -gsand ;D 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barneygale Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Yeah but it's not answering the question. Why not drop the requirement for a central spawnpoint if there's no reason for it other than a tech admin's unexplained personal preference? It restricts the possible builds, as roastnewt has already brought up... The argument could be made that changing the rules now would disadvantage players who've already had to compromise their designs in order to have a central spawnpoint, and I'd be equally satisfied if slide said "oh I thought it would give us some kind of lag/fairness/whatever advantage but apparently I was wrong", but seriously how the hell can you defend this decision without bringing up a single factor that contributed to it? I don't even care if you guys made some kind of miscalculation or tired/drunk decision but at least don't try and defend it by saying "well, slide runs the contest so he can make whatever rules he likes without explanation!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slide Posted January 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Yeah but it's not answering the question. Why not drop the requirement for a central spawnpoint if there's no reason for it other than a tech admin's unexplained personal preference? It restricts the possible builds, as roastnewt has already brought up... The argument could be made that changing the rules now would disadvantage players who've already had to compromise their designs in order to have a central spawnpoint, and I'd be equally satisfied if slide said "oh I thought it would give us some kind of lag/fairness/whatever advantage but apparently I was wrong", but seriously how the hell can you defend this decision without bringing up a single factor that contributed to it? I don't even care if you guys made some kind of miscalculation or tired/drunk decision but at least don't try and defend it by saying "well, slide runs the contest so he can make whatever rules he likes without explanation!" What? So the person running a contest can not make any decisions based on their preferences? I want this lobby contest to have entries with a center spawn. Why do you hate the staff so much, that we can do nothing right apparently? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denevien Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Yeah but it's not answering the question. Why not drop the requirement for a central spawnpoint if there's no reason for it other than a tech admin's unexplained personal preference? It restricts the possible builds, as roastnewt has already brought up... The argument could be made that changing the rules now would disadvantage players who've already had to compromise their designs in order to have a central spawnpoint, and I'd be equally satisfied if slide said "oh I thought it would give us some kind of lag/fairness/whatever advantage but apparently I was wrong", but seriously how the hell can you defend this decision without bringing up a single factor that contributed to it? I don't even care if you guys made some kind of miscalculation or tired/drunk decision but at least don't try and defend it by saying "well, slide runs the contest so he can make whatever rules he likes without explanation!" The rules were laid out in the first post. Which was even before we opened up the Event server for the contest. Yes, this may restrict builds, but thats part of the creative fun, having to work with what you're given. Some players decided to start outside of the planned event by doing things on singleplayer/other server, but that was outside our control. We laid the rules out, and then opened the server for people to compete with a given set of rules. As we said, there will be future contests, and if someone has a design that would fit other rules, they can wait for the next one to submit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barneygale Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Can you just tell me why your personal preference is for it to be in the middle? This is like the 4th time I've asked now. You don't need to hate staff to ask perfectly reasonable questions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Four_Down Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 It allows all players the chance to see the competition. It would be unfair for those who don't have access to World Edit outside of Event to have to build it in game for everyone to see, but not get to see what they're up against. I see your reasoning here, with people not being able to see what they're up against, but I still don't think that it's fair that people who built them off the server are only given 4 days VS just short of a month. That's a massive difference in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slide Posted January 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Can you just tell me why your personal preference is for it to be in the middle? This is like the 4th time I've asked now. You don't need to hate staff to ask perfectly reasonable questions. "Well, huh, might as, might as well ask why is a tree good? Why is the sunset good? Why are boobs good? Man, firecrackers, ya stick 'em in mailboxes, you drop 'em in toilets, shove 'em up bullfrogs asses." That's just the way I prefer it setup. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slide Posted January 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 I see your reasoning here, with people not being able to see what they're up against, but I still don't think that it's fair that people who built them off the server are only given 4 days VS just short of a month. That's a massive difference in time. All they have to do is get whatever they have done, imported by Wed. It doesn't have to be finished, they can keep working on it on the event server. They have the exact same amount of time as everyone else. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denevien Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 I see your reasoning here, with people not being able to see what they're up against, but I still don't think that it's fair that people who built them off the server are only given 4 days VS just short of a month. That's a massive difference in time. As I said, it doesn't have to be complete. We are just allowing people to move their current progress in. At no point have we said its only completed builds that can't be edited ever again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Four_Down Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 As I said, it doesn't have to be complete. We are just allowing people to move their current progress in. At no point have we said its only completed builds that can't be edited ever again. Okay, that makes sense. Just to double confirm, this means that anyone who has not submitted their "off nerd" build whether complete or not by Wednesday will have to wait until the next contest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TornadoHorse Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 "Well, huh, might as, might as well ask why is a tree good? Why is the sunset good? Why are boobs good? Man, firecrackers, ya stick 'em in mailboxes, you drop 'em in toilets, shove 'em up bullfrogs asses." That's just the way I prefer it setup. This will seem like I'm picking hairs, I don't mean to be. Why is that the way you prefer it? Do you think it looks nicer, is it more functional etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barneygale Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 WCS explained the central spawn idea on IRC. The idea is that it's to make the building more challenging / focused, as build competitions that are too open-ended can discourage people from building. That's a perfectly fine rationale to me, though I think requiring a specific spawn point is a very blunt instrument to achieve this. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slide Posted January 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Design contests always have limitations that are imposed by the person(s) putting the contest on. They may seem arbitrary but as there aren't really many technical limitations, there HAVE to be "arbitrary" rules. Usually these rules go along with the person putting the contest on and their vision. My vision for all the work I've done on the lobby, currently includes a center spawn. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Four_Down Posted January 20, 2014 Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Where do we submit schematics to be pasted in? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slide Posted January 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2014 Where do we submit schematics to be pasted in? Message me a link or /mail or find me in game 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roastnewt Posted January 21, 2014 Report Share Posted January 21, 2014 Slide - would it be possible to expand the border a bit? It looks like all the plots are claimed save one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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