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Mumberthrax

FOIA Requests?

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What's the process for requesting a post in the admin forum or private mod chat forum be made public? (like the freedom of information act in the USA)

 

There are a few that I posted and/or upvoted in those forums as an admin that I believe the players would find valuable, including but not limited to discussions about a modded server, our admin meeting notes, ban system overhauls, land claim policy on PvE, and a minigame server.

 

edit: if I recall correctly, I don't think any of those had personal information or anything sensitive on them. I imagine they are no longer actively being discussed (most were basically dead threads before I was removed as admin) so it is not like non-admins or non-staff will be disrupting the planning process.

Edited by Mumberthrax
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I think it should be standard procedure to make most admin posts regarding subjects which are no longer relevant or important (within a reasonable time period) to be made public - regardless of people requesting that they are made public. I'd personally like to see more posts moved to the public archives for users to read to gain an important perspective behind how controversial subjects were discussed and how procedures were determined for personal reference when discussing said subjects.

 

For those reasons, I think that a request system would be a good idea, but I also would like to see more things moved from private discussion areas into public archives more often.

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I noticed the other day that there were a few posts that the discussion had ended and could be moved over to the archives, but I have not sat down and gone through all of them yet. Give me a week or two to go through all of them and see what can be moved over and so I can make the appropriate edits if necessary.

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just a friendly bump.

I'm currently compiling a list of threads that I feel could be moved and intend to share it with the Heads and other Admins in the next day or two. Hopefully we can get things moved within the next week or two.

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just a friendly bump.

Sorry about that. I made a list a week or so ago, but got side tracked and forgot to post it in admin chat to get the other admins' opinion on what needs to be edited and whatnot. We can compare it to the list Switch made and get the final list of thread to moved over in let's say 2 weeks just to be safe.

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So I was looking at the process that the Freedom of Information legislation in the US stipulates, and it sounds like in the case of interacting with federal agencies the FOI requests are generally expected to be as specific as possible about which documents/files are sought. Bearing this in mind, I've decided to be more specific about the forum posts I'd like to see made public. I'd like the full contents of the following posts, as well as all comments made on them to be made public:

  1. The posts announcing admin meetings, and delineating the agendas of admin meetings since December, including the comments before the meetings and the comments after the meetings.
  2. The post scherererer made relating to alternate minecraft servers, specifically minigame server, modded minecraft server, and "adventure" server, including all comments made on that post.
  3. The post TheAcademician made about land claim policy on PvE in the admin forum
  4. The post that I made about seeking admin input regarding suggestions made to the sadmins for revising S
  5. The post TheAcademician made seeking moderator input on suggestions and ideas for revising S
  6. Any and all posts relating to the matter of the removal of myself as sadmin
  7. The post created by mrloud (if i recall correctly) regarding policy for bans for ban evasion using alt accounts
  8. The post I created about an overhaul of ban policy
  9. Any posts which discuss any of the suggestions submitted to the head admin uservoice page
  10. The Mass Ban Amnesty post that I created in the admin forum.

Hopefully having this list will make the process of releasing posts publicly to be more simple and swift.

 

edit: added mass ban amnesty post to the list

Edited by Mumberthrax
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  1. Any and all posts relating to the matter of the removal of myself as sadmin

 

 

You were not removed, you resigned.   We have made a decision not to discuss your resignation in public out of respect for the work you and Aca have done and these threads will not be released.

 

I believe most of these other threads are slated for release, its just time consuming going through them to remove items that relate to specific people / privacy concerns.

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You were not removed, you resigned.

 

This is not entirely accurate. You and the other head admins stated that we were no longer to be sadmins, seemingly out of the blue, and relegated us to a sort of limbo admin position. It was after this that I requested Slide remove my staff permissions in protest of the way we were treated. Mrloud reached out to us after this speaking unofficially and invited us to return as sadmins, and TheAcademician and I accepted the terms - which were almost the exact same as the situation we had before you announced to us we would be removed. the only question was whether the other head admins would agree. You all decided you did not want us as sadmins, and mrloud informed me of this. I respect that you must attempt to save face, but it is dishonorable to bend the truth in this manner. I'm sorry.

 

 

We have made a decision not to discuss your resignation in public out of respect for the work you and Aca have done and these threads will not be released.

 

I hope that you'll forgive me if I say this seems at least partially disingenuous. Perhaps you would consider releasing the discussions to myself and Aca privately, and we can determine if publishing the information would be preferable? I particularly would like to see the post(s) about the matter created *after* we no longer had staff permissions.

 

I just remembered I'd like to add another item to my request list: The post I made regarding a mass ban amnesty in the admin forum. If you'd add that one in there, I'd appreciate it.

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Mumber we will not be releasing or discussing your resignation in public.  I can't stop you from doing it, but we're not going to be part of creating drama on the forums.

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Alright, I can understand that. I guess for me it feels like an injustice was committed, and that you're just trying to cover it up. Like, I feel betrayed, if that makes any sense. The notion of it all being laid out for public accountability is appealing to me for those reasons. I'm not sure how we can have accountability without the potential for drama.

 

I think mistakes were made, and it disappoints me greatly that there is no apology or acknowledgment of those mistakes, or explanation for how they even came to be. Perhaps this is a personal issue that I will have to accept there is no restitution for, and from which to move on. I guess everyone involved will just have to be accountable to their own conscience and integrity.

 

In any case, I hope that you will release the other forum posts as well for the benefit of the community. I don't recall any personal or private information on any of the ones I mentioned in my list, except maybe one or two banned users being mentioned in the ban evasion discussion. It should not take over a month to look through a few posts and see if there's anything that ought to be removed, and if not then toss them one-by-one into the archives.

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Noticed that some posts were moved to the archives last night. Thanks! Here's what remains on my list:

 

 

  1. The posts announcing admin meetings, and delineating the agendas of admin meetings since December, including the comments before the meetings and the comments after the meetings.
  2. The post scherererer made relating to alternate minecraft servers, specifically minigame server, modded minecraft server, and "adventure" server, including all comments made on that post.
  3. The post TheAcademician made about land claim policy on PvE in the admin forum
  4. The post that I made about seeking admin input regarding suggestions made to the sadmins for revising S
  5. The post TheAcademician made seeking moderator input on suggestions and ideas for revising S
  6. Any and all posts relating to the matter of the removal of myself as sadmin
  7. The post created by mrloud (if i recall correctly) regarding policy for bans for ban evasion using alt accounts
  8. The post I created about an overhaul of ban policy
  9. Any posts which discuss any of the suggestions submitted to the head admin uservoice page
  10. The Mass Ban Amnesty post that I created in the admin forum.
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Has been over two weeks since my last bump. Just curious if there is any work being done to get the remaining posts/discussions in my list published.

 

 

Bump_.gif

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Another two weeks. Bumping again. Hoping to hear an update on the process of reviewing the few items on my list above.

 

Edit:

 

 

1354196268815.gif

Edited by Mumberthrax
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Ah nice, another one published. https://nerd.nu/forums/topic/2838-development-of-post-rev27-survival/
 
I can't say that I see how this one was a struggle to evaluate for whether it contained any sensitive information that needed to be censored, but I am glad it was finally published. Thanks, Mrloud. I've updated my list of requested posts with #4 now crossed off:
 

 

edit: formatting

Edited by Mumberthrax

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Ah nice, another one published. https://nerd.nu/forums/topic/2838-development-of-post-rev27-survival/

 

I can't say that I see how this one was a struggle to evaluate for whether it contained any sensitive information that needed to be censored, but I am glad it was finally published. Thanks, Mrloud. I've updated my list of requested posts with #4 now crossed off:

 

 

edit: formatting

Just to give a bit of info:

 

1.) We intend to move some admin meetings over in the future but none of the heads of gotten around to looking at them yet.

9.) Will look into that...

10.) This has not been moved as it is still being actively discussed.

 

I have already bumped a post for moving posts over a day or so ago, however after a few more days I will pester the heads again for moving more things over.

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Just noticed that one more post from my list was moved over to the archives a few days ago: https://nerd.nu/forums/topic/2938-pmc-survival-features-survey
Nifty. I'll cross it off my list from the number 5 spot. Thank you for moving it, Mrloud.

 


I also would like to publicly thank Barlimore here for reaching out to me via IRC on the 19th of June about this, and for all the work he's put into transparency. Thank you, Barlimore.

 

 

36e89g.jpg

 

Edit: Switch, you're awesome too for responding above, and for whatever pestering you did. Thanks. : ]

Edited by Mumberthrax

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1. This is on my todo list for this weekend.

6.

8. I will also be getting to this one in the next day or two.

9. A lot of those topics were discussed in other places like IRC and mumble, but I will see what I can find when I go through all of the closed topics this weekend. Are there any specific topics you are looking for?

10.This is still on going and will be moved over once it's completed. 

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9. A lot of those topics were discussed in other places like IRC and mumble, but I will see what I can find when I go through all of the closed topics this weekend. Are there any specific topics you are looking for?

 

Well I would go back and look through all of the open ones, but it seems you guys have closed the account down without transferring the suggestions over to the new suggestion sub-forum. Generally I was curious if there were any forum discussions at all about any of the suggestions in the uservoice page, or if it was just whoever was active on IRC when the topic came up would opine, or if they got any discussion at all. Schererererer mentioned at one point here on the forums that he had forgotten the uservoice existed, so I got the impression that there wasn't any active discussion in IRC/Mumble that he was a part of as head admin.

 

The main ones I remember existing were:

  • the suggestion about creating the suggestion subforum which I made on the uservoice page
  • the suggestion I made about opening a modded server up
  • the suggestion that was most highly voted on about opening a modded server up
  • and I think I recall a suggestion about not closing suggestions without explaining why

But if i recall correctly there were about twice as many as that on the page in total, I just don't recall what they all were and have no way now of going back to check on them. Were any of them backed up before the account was shut down?

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I have not forgotten about this, it's just taking a little more time than I thought to go through everything. It should be done by the end of the week.

 

But if i recall correctly there were about twice as many as that on the page in total, I just don't recall what they all were and have no way now of going back to check on them. Were any of them backed up before the account was shut down?

I changed the URL so people would not submit things there and use the suggestion forum instead. I had written down the URL that I changed it to we could go back to it if we ever needed to, but it looks like uservoice has changed how they do accounts and I can't access the free account we used to have.

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