What we can do with griefers

[GMMan]

I suggest using making griefers serve community service on C. As you may know, there are usually a couple of massive dig projects going on at any given time, and since griefers like to destroy stuff, we might as well put their destructive powers to some good use. What I suggest is to create a special user group for them, and limit their build powers to certain regions that need clearing. If possible, prevent them from placing blocks as well, and only allow them to destroy blocks. That way they can't reverse grief and all that they do can only be considered constructive. When a player is discovered griefing, put them in the jail at spawn, and give them the option of either being banned or doing community service. If they choose community service, add them to the griefers group and warp them to the area that needs clearing. They will still have the option of appealing the ban. The end result is either they get bored and quit the server, or they become helpful.

 

I understand the way griefers usually operate is to make a mess of others work to make themselves feel good, and while this idea doesn't accommodate for the lava pouring type, at least it'll work for those who merely need to vent some anger.

[Ozomahtlii]

If they would choose for community service and are actual griefers that grief to troll, they would place blocks in stead of destroy and I don't think it's possible to have only destroy options on players. Not sure though

[buzzinbee]

Thanks for the idea GMMan however, many players enjoy digging themselves and also the system of banning the griefers and rolling them back has been working very well so far so I think we will stick with the traditional way. But again thanks for the idea :)

[Jauris]

Eh.... we've had the same system in place for like 3 years, I don't really see a need to change anything.

[xXNjordXx]

Well as fun as that idea sounds, i dont think that it would work.
Why ? simply because of thesereasons:

 

 

 

• They need to log in to carry out their sentences
• Most griefers got Alt Accounts
• The Community probaply wouldnt trust them enough to let them "help"

 

Dont get me wrong i like the idea of having them contribute to the server, but we cant force them to do so.

[MasterCommaThe]

I think this idea is great, much like muting offensive players instead of banning them. I don't think we even need to ask if they'd be willing, they will determine that for themselves.

I volunteer the UnderTown dig on C as the worksite. The tunnel is planned to be endless.

I propose it should work thusly:
-mod types /prison <playername> for griefers that commit no other offense

-/prison command teleports the griefer to the worksite
-instructions at site state that their ban length will be shortened by 1 day for every 10K stone and dirt blocks broken. They must still appeal to be /unprisoned
-/prison uses the same system that prevents people from going beyond the map borders to limit them to the worksite

-/prison causes any block placed to autokick the griefer and rollback the last edit, just like our TNT autokicking.


Can a tech tell us if this is possible?

[MasterCommaThe]

As a stretch goal:

 

/prison should automatically equip the player with orange or pink dyed leather. Your choice.

[Jauris]

Why do we need this? What is so wrong with our current system that it needs changing?

[GMMan]

Well as fun as that idea sounds, i dont think that it would work.

Why ? simply because of thesereasons:

 

 

 

• They need to log in to carry out their sentences
• Most griefers got Alt Accounts
• The Community probaply wouldnt trust them enough to let them "help"

 

Dont get me wrong i like the idea of having them contribute to the server, but we cant force them to do so.

Ah, I forgot about alt accounts. I would treat it like a regular ban, except they are still allowed to interact with the server on a limited basis.

 

Why do we need this? What is so wrong with our current system that it needs changing?

It's not that there's anything wrong with the current system. It's just an alternative that could potentially be useful. Give the illusion of choice, you know.

[GMMan]

I think this idea is great, much like muting offensive players instead of banning them. I don't think we even need to ask if they'd be willing, they will determine that for themselves.

I volunteer the UnderTown dig on C as the worksite. The tunnel is planned to be endless.

I propose it should work thusly:

-mod types /prison <playername> for griefers that commit no other offense

-/prison command teleports the griefer to the worksite

-instructions at site state that their ban length will be shortened by 1 day for every 10K stone and dirt blocks broken. They must still appeal to be /unprisoned

-/prison uses the same system that prevents people from going beyond the map borders to limit them to the worksite

-/prison causes any block placed to autokick the griefer and rollback the last edit, just like our TNT autokicking.

Can a tech tell us if this is possible?

In my opinion digs shouldn't be treated strictly as prisons. As buzzinbee mentioned above, players do like to dig themselves too. I dug out a large chunk of UnderTown, and I wasn't under any obligation to do so. Only give instructions as a private message or mail, and for everyone else it'll be like nothing ever happened. Of course, sites may get a bit of notoriety if people start noticing...

[xXNjordXx]

The problem is, even if it were technicaly possible. Should we really do this ?

Normaly the bans are taken care of quitly without interupting the players on the servers too much, this helps keeping the drama at a minimum.

Its just a good method a player gets banned, he appeals, in the best case he sees what he did wrong and apologizes, gets unbanned and has a white west again.

 

If the banned player would be forced by us to help others it wouldnt be the right thing to do

[Guest Former Staff]

I can see the logic behind this suggestion, however I am against the idea.

 

While griefers are a part of this community in the sense that they are banned daily, they do not deserve to have the resources wasted on them to continue being logged in. By rolling griefers back and banning them (in cases where needed, in the same command!) this ensures that we spend more time focused on the community who deserve the attention, and not the people who detract from it.

 

If this idea were implemented, this would require more moderation on the servers as griefers tend to exploit by any means necessary. Griefers don't just grief, they troll, they spam (chat / modreqs) and can actively harass players. Not to mention having the Tech Admins devote time and effort to adapting a build rank just so that griefers can play!

 

They aren't worth it. The ones who appeal, own up to mistakes and take ownership are the only griefers that I am interested in helping.

[pokegeek1234]

We're not the average irl community. We can't tell players to do community service to shorten their ban length. It's kind of like telling someone who's kidnapped a little girl that if they move this many rocks in the jail then you get this many days less of being imprisoned. It doesn't work that way. I'm against this.

[Cyotie911]

current way to deal with griefers...

Step one. Lock griefer in survival mode.

Step two. Mute griefer.

Step three. Light griefer on fire.

Step four. /thor griefer.

Step five. Take away griefers ability to run commands.

Step six. Teleport griefer to Cyotie911's box of shame.

Step seven. Ban griefer.

Step eight. Griefer appeals and ban length set.

My method leaves several minutes for a griefer to be honest and apologize for breaking the rules before step eight. Thing is, most act angry they were caught and aren't sorry.

If they don't want to be here and don't want to play by the rules then I would rather they weren't here.

systems not broke. let's not try to fix it.

[Weazol]

While I am not suggesting that we change what is already in place...

 

I just wanted to point out that there is a bukkit plugin for jail.

With this plugin you can /jail player time

You can set the jail to be a dig site where the player will be sent to.

 

Features of this include

+ Muting the player while in "jail"

+ Giving player perms to only break blocks (and to my knowledge you can even limit this to certian blocks)

+ You can set it by time limit or how many blocks they break

+ If it is set by time then the player must be logged in for the counter to start ticking and they cannot be AFK (if they AFK the mod will kick them)

+ Multiple Jails can be set up.

+ Players lose all their items while in jail (so jail must provide tools and food)

+ If a Player attempts to break out from jail then time will be added to their sentence

[Verros]

current way to deal with griefers...

Step one. Lock griefer in survival mode.

Step two. Mute griefer.

Step three. Light griefer on fire.

Step four. /thor griefer.

Step five. Take away griefers ability to run commands.

Step six. Teleport griefer to Cyotie911's box of shame.

Step seven. Ban griefer.

Step eight. Griefer appeals and ban length set.

My method leaves several minutes for a griefer to be honest and apologize for breaking the rules before step eight. Thing is, most act angry they were caught and aren't sorry.

If they don't want to be here and don't want to play by the rules then I would rather they weren't here.

systems not broke. let's not try to fix it.

 

Steps 1-6 all at once seems a bit overkill, you should try trimming down that list to 7 and 8... and maybe keep 2... and 5 depending on the situation. (Also you forgot about rollbacks).

 

For the sake of conversation, we need a trained rabid velociraptor to be able to unleash upon unsuspecting rule-breaking users. I think we can all tell why.

 

No, I cannot take this seriously.

[Cyotie911]

Steps 1-6 all at once seems a bit overkill, you should try trimming down that list to 7 and 8... and maybe keep 2... and 5 depending on the situation. (Also you forgot about rollbacks).

 

For the sake of conversation, we need a trained rabid velociraptor to be able to unleash upon unsuspecting rule-breaking users. I think we can all tell why.

 

No, I cannot take this seriously.

No, you mistook my actions as an all at once. Normally I do each step 4-8 minutes apart from each other. Normally, If a griefer (depending on the severity of the grief) will be forgiven and account noted if they take the "oh, you caught me. I'm sorry" approach. The ones that continue to lie when confronted will normally make it to step #7 and then never appeal.

[Verros]

No, you mistook my actions as an all at once. Normally I do each step 4-8 minutes apart from each other. Normally, If a griefer (depending on the severity of the grief) will be forgiven and account noted if they take the "oh, you caught me. I'm sorry" approach. The ones that continue to lie when confronted will normally make it to step #7 and then never appeal.

Ah, I get it, but that still takes a long time to do.

 

Also velociraptors are still cool.

[Cyotie911]

Ah, I get it, but that still takes a long time to do.

 

Also velociraptors are still cool.

 

Could also feed them to a pack of hungry pigs!

[MasterCommaThe]

I think the point was missed as this post expanded. Some of us would like to try to use griefers for our a good purpose. Not everyone has to do this. Regardless of whether this works out in the end, is there a good reason not to do this? If not, can we make it happen?

[Guest Former Staff]

I think the point was missed as this post expanded. Some of us would like to try to use griefers for our a good purpose. Not everyone has to do this. Regardless of whether this works out in the end, is there a good reason not to do this? If not, can we make it happen?

 

I think you're right, MasterCommaThe that we have diverted from the original topic, however I can see that there was sufficient reason not to do this which was highlighted across the posts. I've cut some of those quotes and tried to avoid personal opinion for clarity.

 

 

 

 

Well as fun as that idea sounds, i dont think that it would work.

Why ? simply because of thesereasons:

 

 

 

• They need to log in to carry out their sentences
• Most griefers got Alt Accounts
• The Community probaply wouldnt trust them enough to let them "help"

 

Dont get me wrong i like the idea of having them contribute to the server, but we cant force them to do so.

 

xXNjordXx here highlighted the issue of them having to be logged in and forced to carry out their punishments. Whereas when a player is banned, they are serving their punishment from the ban moment through to the appeal and subsequent unban.

 

 

Normaly the bans are taken care of quitly without interupting the players on the servers too much, this helps keeping the drama at a minimum.

 

xXNjordXx touched upon this in the former quote; People would not trust someone who is marked as a griefer as there would be some identification or way to realise who these individuals are. The chat quality would decrease with public humiliation of the griefers and moderation would require additional attention.

 

 

We're not the average irl community. We can't tell players to do community service to shorten their ban length. It's kind of like telling someone who's kidnapped a little girl that if they move this many rocks in the jail then you get this many days less of being imprisoned. It doesn't work that way. I'm against this.

 

Pokegeek's quote was similar to xXNjordXx's point where we cannot force people to stay logged in to serve their punishment. Assuming this would be in place, there would be additional moderation for when the griefers have "served" their sentence. 10,000 blocks broken, 5 hours digging, where is the line when it comes to this.

 

 

 

While griefers are a part of this community in the sense that they are banned daily, they do not deserve to have the resources wasted on them to continue being logged in.

 

Although I expanded upon this line further to explain why this is so important. I feel this speaks for itself. We need to focus our time, planning and productivity into people who play on the servers, not attempt to break them.

[MasterCommaThe]

I think your last point really seals the deal. Accepted. A fun thought exercise though. Thank you!

[Cyotie911]

I think the point was missed as this post expanded. Some of us would like to try to use griefers for our a good purpose. Not everyone has to do this. Regardless of whether this works out in the end, is there a good reason not to do this? If not, can we make it happen?

 

Pretty much the reason behind not doing this, is because it makes a lot of extra work for the staff.  Keeping track of who does what.  Writing the extra plugins to enforce a player to be able to only dig and not place blocks, setting up a way for players to be able to choose between service and a ban length and then the time it takes to determine an appropriate service length.

 

Just way to much work.