Other languages than English on global

[Guest]

So the last days there's been these Swedish speaking guys in global. I wouldn't mind if it was just a little bit of it, but they've pretty much taken over the chat (seriously only Swedish for ages and I believe some new people on the server are quite confused where they've come) with their talk and they have do not seem to want to take it to private messages or clanchat. I guess there's no rule against it, but there's a lot of us who's quite annoyed by it, so I propose a rule that English would be the language to use in global and if you like to use your mothertongue on the server, you'd have to take it into clanchats.

[varuka]

Isn't the server hosted in Sweden? .nu is a Swedish extension. 

[Guest]

Isn't the server hosted in Sweden? .nu is a Swedish extension. 

 

Erm. No it's not.

 

Sweden has .se. Apparently .nu belongs to the island state of Niue.

 

And what difference does that make anyway? :D It's not a Swedish server.

[djt832]

I'm not sure having a rule excluding all other languages from global chat is really the best idea.

[xXNjordXx]

I'm not sure having a rule excluding all other languages from global chat is really the best idea.

 

I have encountered such rules on many different servers and its never been a problem.

Mainchat always had to be english and all other chats Clanchat whispers etc was up to the people that used it.

 

 

Since almost everyone understands english its easier to monitor for the moderators.

Do i know if i was just insulted in chinese, french or swedish ? No i don't.

Do i know if that guy wants me to help him or if im standing on his claim ? Again the answer is no.

And neither do most of the mods or admins, so they cant help or intervene.

 

Another problem with non english languages in the mainchat is that the other languages will be ignored most of the time.

Again because almost no one understands them, meaning they are separating themselfes from the community and at least from what i know thats something that should be avoided

[TornadoHorse]

I have encountered such rules on many different servers and its never been a problem.

Mainchat always had to be english and all other chats Clanchat whispers etc was up to the people that used it.

 

 

Since almost everyone understands english its easier to monitor for the moderators.

 

I've seen this too. I can't say I fully agree with it, but I understand why they do it and for good reason.

 

Do i know if i was just insulted in chinese, french or swedish ? No i don't.

Do i know if that guy wants me to help him or if im standing on his claim ? Again the answer is no.

And neither do most of the mods or admins, so they cant help or intervene.

 

If they want to speak to other people on the server then they'd know to use the same language as them. They're gonna be smart enough to figure out that no one understands their own language. I'd only see this being a problem if they're constantly being openly racist/sexist/homophobic, but I doubt that would occur.

 

Another problem with non english languages in the mainchat is that the other languages will be ignored most of the time.

Again because almost no one understands them, meaning they are separating themselfes from the community and at least from what i know thats something that should be avoided

 

If they're being made to use private messages instead of open chat then they're further separating themselves from the community rather than being more involved.

[Difficult1]

Personally i think global should remain english for reasons already mentioned, but if certain people speak another language and thats easier or they dont know english, they could quite easly make a clanchat for them to communicate.

[joshuaherman]

I don't think this would be a good idea. Why does english have higher priority over other languages?

[Guest]

I don't think this would be a good idea. Why does english have higher priority over other languages?

 

Because it's the common language we have.

[TheRandomnatrix]

My view on it is that being a primarily English server, something spoken in a different language is going to come off as incomprehensible to well over 90% of the people playing, which I don't really see as any different than spam. It's impossible to moderate as well. For all I know they could be shouting racist profanities and I'd be none the wiser, unless I painstakingly run it through translation software. I usually just ask those people when they come on to either switch to English or take it to pm/clanchat. If they can't speak English they're going to be hard pressed to participate in a community they can't understand.

[Tim9724]

Removed

Edited July 19, 2020 by Tim9724

[SwitchViewz]

If they're being made to use private messages instead of open chat then they're further separating themselves from the community rather than being more involved.

 

The problem with this is that if they are talking in a non english language then 95% of us won't be unable to understand them which itself is preventing them from being involved in the community. If they don't speak English how can we expect them to get involved when we all speak English?

[TornadoHorse]

The problem with this is that if they are talking in a non english language then 95% of us won't be unable to understand them which itself is preventing them from being involved in the community. If they don't speak English how can we expect them to get involved when we all speak English?

 

You can't. Regardless of where they speak, that won't change so it's not really an issue.

[Magnyus]

I'm convinced that our domain being .nu is part of an old joke that was acted upon when the servers were created, but by no means are we based in Niue.

 

This is a problem I encountered quite a while ago and I spoke with Cadmin at the time, Barlimore who told me that there isn't really a way to force or moderate people who speak in their native tongues in global. and there have been many times where I have been aware of people exclaiming profanities at other players. At times it can be annoying but there should be at least some form of controlling where people can speak.

 

What I had proposed during that time was to make clanchat easier to use, especially for newer (and in this case non-english speaking) players. I liked the idea of making it a toggle so it wouldn't be annoying to type /c for every message.

 

Another good way of making it clear to players that they can speak their native tongues in clanchat would be to use the alert system to send a nice, visible, purple message that provide instructions on how to join that chat for said language.

 

For Example: Digitar "/clanchat join Español" para hablar en español con tus amigos!

As well as any variation of that for any language. That way when players start talking in their language a moderator or admin can simply make the alert appear in global, and if they're decent people, they'll go.

 

Again, that is not a solution to the 'problem' because regardless of warnings (even for players that speak English) some simply refuse to go to clanchat, and that's when the mutes start getting handed out. It would still be nice for the servers to be a little more forgiving for those international player that don't speak what the majority does.

[redwall_hp]

Thats like saying if a foreigner enters another country and doesn't speak the native language in that country they should be deported. Thats stupid.

 

That's not necessarily uncommon. To immigrate to most countries, you have to be able to understand their language. I doubt you'd be considered as a candidate for immigration in, say, Sweden or France, if you didn't learn the local language. (And if you're just visiting, it only makes sense to do so...)

[Mumberthrax]

I think this is an interesting situation that likely isn't constrained to our server alone. So I did a quick internet search.

 

In this article, the author suggests implementation of an in-game translation subroutine - basically something that queries google translator and feeds the result to player(s) in-game, rather than having the players copy-paste stuff themselves in a browser window: http://www.lazygamer.net/general-news/online-gaming-and-the-language-barrier/

 

Another article I came across suggested the same sort of thing: http://www.ironrealms.com/tearing-down-language-barriers-in-mmo-games

 

I took a few minutes to search the bukkit dev and spigot websites for plugins that might fulfil this function, and found a few projects that may hold value in this regard:

• http://www.spigotmc.org/resources/translator.476/
• http://dev.bukkit.org/bukkit-plugins/language-message-translator/
• http://dev.bukkit.org/bukkit-plugins/trans/
• http://dev.bukkit.org/bukkit-plugins/sayagain/

There may be others I've overlooked. I think these plugins warrant some testing.

 

In the next result from my search, players debate the same matter on a more voice-chat oriented game, where there are already servers for specific geographical regions, and the overall vote seems to be to allow anyone to play on whatever region server they prefer regardless of language: http://forum.worldoftanksxbox360edition.com/index.php?/topic/16221-cross-server-language-barriers-to-co-op-mmo-theory/

 

some more discussion of this subject:

• http://www.reignofgaming.net/forums/strategy/champions-and-gameplay/30259-reporting-question-and-the-language-barrier
• http://www.onrpg.com/articles/news/mmo-games-and-the-language-barrier/

I am undecided at this point what sort of action (if any) should be taken regarding this matter, though I think the translation plugins might be a possible solution that should be investigated.

[barneygale]

Uhg I think it would be really terrible to only allow english. This question has come up before and I think I recall Lude quite firmly saying people can use whatever language they want. The only situation where it matters is when a mod needs to talk to the player about something (land dispute, etc) and even then there's a reasonable chance we have someone on staff who speaks their language.

[djt832]

I would like too see nerd look into some of the solutions Mumberthrax provided. Our best option would be to make the language barrier less noticeable rather than fix an issue by eradication.  

 

I still do not think excluding other languages from global chat is a good idea. Yes, on the moderation side, it does create difficulties if you cannot understand what they are saying. However, banning or warning users for not using English in global chat and forcing them to use clan chat seems a bit excessive. As far as I know, we do not get a lot of users who speak languages other than English anyway. Most users from foreign countries, especially Sweden, have studied the English language and should be able to effectively communicate to moderators if need be. 

 

My view on it is that being a primarily English server, something spoken in a different language is going to come off as incomprehensible to well over 90% of the people playing, which I don't really see as any different than spam.

 

Just because we cannot fully understand something does not mean it is spam. Even in a different language than English, it would still be easy to discern spam from normal conversation based on the speed and repetitiveness of the messages. 

[totemo]

You guys need to recognise that it's an international server and for the sake of equality we must be tolerant and welcoming of players from non-English-speaking backgrounds.  I put up with all of you lot speaking American, even though I find it a little bit off-colour, and despite everything, Reddit Public is still my favourite server.

Edited May 28, 2014 by totemo

[Guest]

The situation was mostly triggered by a couple players who kept talking nonsense in Swedish in global chat to the point there was nothing to be seen but Swedish all over for a few days. It seems those who did not witness this are against this which I understand. Some foreign language here and there is no problem. I understand Swedish myself and I was really fed up with those guys since they were repeatedly just making commentary of where they are, asking where the other guy is, what had they just mined etc. They didn't react at all when they were kindly asked to take the nonsense chatter to /msg or make a clanchat for it (even in Swedish, they just didn't react).

 

I noticed the other guy is now banned for griefing, which is no surprise since the chat that was ongoing was bordering trolling.

 

Sure we are an international server but surely there's some limit? I got no desire to speak Finnish with the other Finns in global. English works just fine. I'm indeed on an international server. If I wanted to speak Finnish I'd find a Finnish server with Finnish people in it.

 

Also when new people joined in all they were seeing was Swedish. What would you think when you join a new server and all you can see is some people talking in a foreign language? Would you stay?

 

So to clarify, I'd like to see that excessive use of foreign languages would be discouraged in global.

Edited May 28, 2014 by Guest

[joshuaherman]

I agree with Totemo and barneygale. This would be a horrible idea. It would also go against our servers core values. We pride ourselves on no homophobia and no hate speech. If general chat is being flooded why can't you use use clanchat? They aren't violating any server rules by speaking another language and they shouldn't be restricted. If we implement an automatic translation system that will flood global chat even worse and the translation system will be buggy and inconsistent and possibly even start arguments.

[Guest]

I agree with Totemo and barneygale. This would be a horrible idea. It would also go against our servers core values. We pride ourselves on no homophobia and no hate speech. If general chat is being flooded why can't you use use clanchat? They aren't violating any server rules by speaking another language and they shouldn't be restricted. If we implement an automatic translation system that will flood global chat even worse and the translation system will be buggy and inconsistent and possibly even start arguments.

 

Option to mute/ignore players would be better.

[CROCKODUCK]

The situation was mostly triggered by a couple players who kept talking nonsense in Swedish in global chat to the point there was nothing to be seen but Swedish all over for a few days. It seems those who did not witness this are against this which I understand. Some foreign language here and there is no problem. I understand Swedish myself and I was really fed up with those guys since they were repeatedly just making commentary of where they are, asking where the other guy is, what had they just mined etc. They didn't react at all when they were kindly asked to take the nonsense chatter to /msg or make a clanchat for it (even in Swedish, they just didn't react).

 

I noticed the other guy is now banned for griefing, which is no surprise since the chat that was ongoing was bordering trolling.

 

Sure we are an international server but surely there's some limit? I got no desire to speak Finnish with the other Finns in global. English works just fine. I'm indeed on an international server. If I wanted to speak Finnish I'd find a Finnish server with Finnish people in it.

 

Also when new people joined in all they were seeing was Swedish. What would you think when you join a new server and all you can see is some people talking in a foreign language? Would you stay?

 

So to clarify, I'd like to see that excessive use of foreign languages would be discouraged in global.

This is rather harsh.  Simply because they are younger and speaking a different language does not mean you can just kick them out. 

 

If I personally joined another server, I would not care if they spoke another language.  I would put yourself in their position and come to realize they have every much a right to play on these servers as you and that we will not simply remove them or mute them from the servers because they enjoy playing with their friends. 

 

An ignore command would be the best solution if it really needs to come to that. 

[Guest]

This is rather harsh.  Simply because they are younger and speaking a different language does not mean you can just kick them out. 

 

Who has said anything about kicking them out?

 

Also if they're young and simply do not understand or talk English, wouldn't that be a problem in it self? Since they wouldn't have been able to read and understand the rules. 

 

It does seem a lot of people don't support the idea however and I'm fine with that. I did think it bothered more people. If the majority has no problem with it, then there's no need for change ofc.

Edited May 28, 2014 by Guest

[SkrapssparkS]

Skipped a lot of this but in general we used to just see if they were able to speak english. If someone is speaking another language in chat you can say do you speak english if they don't then they will just be talking to themselves or a friend, I've always gone with the idea if someone reports someone for saying something against the rules in another language to ask what they said and try to translate it as much as possible. if nobody notices them say anything in another language I've not seen the harm. Not saying there isn't any but if someone insults me in another language that I don't understand then I honestly don't care too much, if someone insults someone else in another language and they understand it then there is an issue as far as i'm concerned. It's a bit of a grey area but really i don't see a huge problem with people speaking other languages.