From the start of the revision, we set up our expectations of how the revision would play out, including for the first time ever, an estimated timeline for the revision duration.
How are you finding this revision, knowing the revision duration in advance?
Same as the others, since I don't really base what I'm building on any end goal. I have a project to complete that I set for myself at the start of the rev, and build from there once I finish. I do like knowing when the end is so that I don't start building something only to find out that I won't finish it due to the rev ending.
We gave a rough outline for having more events in the latter half of the revision. Would you like more information along these lines in future?
Yes, it's good to know when things are happening.
We made it clear that we wanted to involve you more in the decision making, and did just that with various events and tasks this revision. This involved the pve survey, a poll for the admin hunt location, the death message update and a number of suggestionbox submissions which were implemented
a. We want to continue down this path, and do more. How do you feel we did so far and what more can we look to do?
I think the process was beneficial. I enjoy things more when I can contribute to how they happen in some way, and choosing locations and messages is a fun way to contribute in ways that just playing on the server doesn't allow.
For revision 21, the map size is 9000 x 9000 blocks. We have been considering a smaller overworld map for revision 22, as confirmed in the discussion here.
How have you found the current map size?
I like the size, but a smaller map is better for reasons outlined below.
We believe that returning to a smaller map size for next revision would encourage more community activity - something we are strongly looking to promote. What are your thoughts?
A large map, combined with elytra, is bad for the community. Before elytra, big maps were fun because they required the community to build roads/rails/etc to get around. Now, people get wings after a few days and cities become isolated. This rev has been *much* better for rails than the past few, mostly because the spawn station was pre-built. Last rev had no pre-built station, and no one built one, so rails suffered. If we do large maps in the future, we need to make elytra much harder to get. This map size feels nice since people, myself included, built rails, but there are few major roads for horse travel and I think a slightly smaller map would make roadbuilding more popular an endeavor.
We used the Open Terrain Generator to generate the map and worldpainter to make smaller changes. This terrain generator allows for a variation in the types of biomes and allows us to modify them too before they generate, and worldpainter lets us make more precise changes on a smaller scale by comparison.
How have you found the world generated?
Perfect. It's a great map in terms of biomes and their sizes. I love the mountains in the NE especially.
Which biomes would you like to see more of?
Keep the mountain type used in the NE, and add in some more classic plains.
Which biomes would you like to see less of?
Ocean. The South is too watery. The North has a great river system that gives us lots of fun places to build, but the ocean feels too empty. If we do an ocean that big again, it should have some big islands to attract cities, like Pico this rev.
For the ore distribution this revision, we emulated the values of revision 19 (though there are notable differences). Additionally, compared to last revision, ores would typically generate where you’d expect to find them normally.
How did you find the ore generation this revision?
Fine, much better than last rev. Diamonds and gold feel right again.
Were there any ores you feel were too sparse?
I'd like more quartz in the overworld, but that's not too much of an issue.
Were there any ores you feel were too abundant?
None, all seems fine.
Would you like to see biomes specific ores such as the mesa being plumped for gold?
Yes. No preference as to which ores are plumped where, but biome-based plumping is a fun gameplay element since it can encourage exploring outside the standard biomes.
For this map size, we spread 12 nether portal markers out around the map, with another nether portal at spawn. Each nether portal could be lit within 100 blocks of the marker, and placed in either the upper, or lower nether.
We meticulously planned the bedrock markers to try to provide optimum coverage. How did you find the layout for this revision?
Good, I like the knights' names theme as well.
Given that we are considering a smaller map size, how would you like to see the volume and layout of nether portals?
We only really need 8 portals unless the map is huge. I get why we had 12 this rev though, and having more didn't hurt gameplay.
This revision, we saw the nether divided into an upper nether, which was all entirely custom built by Sir_Didymus, and the lower nether being vanilla generation, with the bedrock roof mostly removed between the two.
Would you like to see an upper nether return again, or shall we explore another format (such as an all-vanilla nether)?
All-vanilla nethers suck. They're boring, no fun to mine or build in, and they suck the fun out of hunting wither skeletons since the terrain is so wonky. I like having a custom-gen nether, particularly the ones we had a few revs ago with the glowstone trees and obsidian pillars. Those were fun, unique, and dangerous without being impossible to navigate.
We introduced a nether spawn this revision, which was built by Barlimore, Sir_Didymus and with staff contributions. We did this to introduce people to the upper/lower nether concept.
I liked the rail stations at the bottom. I'd be fine with another staffmade spawn, perhaps of smaller size.
a. Provided there is an upper nether again; Would you like a nether spawn to return in future, or would you like us to return to tradition and allow you to create your own nether spawn?
If the upper nether comes back, it'd be fun to see what players did with their own spawn.
b. How did you find having a pre-built nether rail station?
It’s the end! This world is typically generated completely vanilla. For this revision, the end was a size of 4500 x 4500.
How do you feel about the size of the end? Should this be smaller?
No real preference, it's fine from what I can tell
We have frequently heard feedback about wanting the end dragon fight made more difficult. How would you feel about the end dragon fight being a non-vanilla experience?
Make the dragon fight very difficult, and require it for a player to get elytra (if you don't make elytra prizes for a quest event.) The dragon is the final boss, and should require a team of players with max enchant gear to kill. Even then, it should be a really damn hard fight. Make the dragon respawnable, and somehow set the part of the end that players use to travel away from the dragon fight. A custom staff-built arena would be a great boss fight for anyone willing to take on the challenge. As for difficulty, imagine a wither that you can't put in a box, but twenty feet tall with three times the health and faster flight. In short, have a really challenging boss that gives really good prizes like wings. This will create an incentive to fight it, and lower the amount of wings on the server.
This revision, mapworld carried over from revision 20, allowing you to keep your plots, maps and modreq for them again without losing your work! We plan to bring mapworld over into revision 22 too.
How have you found the experience of mapworld carrying over into the new revision?
N/A haven't used mapworld.
Which changes would you like to see to mapworld, if any? Worldedit has been a frequent request and an example which we would love to hear feedback upon.
I'd rather have people building on the server than putting time in on mapworld to create things that only they and anyone living with them will likely see. Best to have worldedit, or at least a schematica printer, so people can make what they want without taking time away from sever builds. I'd use mapworld if I didn't have to waste hours putting a map together.
The overworld spawn this revision was curated by defiex, decorated by staff and built by jar9. We confirmed early this rev that the spawn building for revision 22 would be entirely built by nerd staff. With that in mind, we've made early progress on the spawn structure, to ensure a timely completion, and have made sure it fits well with the theme and events planned for revision 22.
We have aimed for a very simple layout, one where you can exit spawn swiftly and clearly, along one of four cardinal roads. We are looking to further mitigate lag at spawn by moving the nether portal away from the spawn point.
a. What would you expect to see from the layout of spawn next revision?
Similar, I liked the simple layout.
2. Which was your favourite Easter egg around spawn this revision?
I haven't been exploring enough to find any yet
3. Are there any spawn ideas you’d like to submit for future?
I'd love to see a Greco-Roman spawn, lots of columns and a temple with a big statue of Zeus/Jupiter (or hell, the whole Parthenon
4. How did you find having a pre-built spawn rail station?
Very useful. This feature needs to return. Could even integrate the station into spawn itself.
Iron Golem Spawners
This revision, we replaced the wither skull cost from iron golem spawners and replaced it with a 1/500 chance of naturally generated iron ore of dropping a ‘golem soul’. We continued the practice of having these spawner costs lower each month, to make them more accessible to those outside of towns.
More than 1000 golem souls have been mined in the revision so far, resulting in iron golem spawners bought swiftly and with spare golem souls going towards a community contribution for special villagers.
a. How would you like to see the iron golem spawner costs adjusted for the next revision?
Keep them like they are. I like the golem soul mechanic, and the amount of iron in circulation stimulates rail building.
b. Would you like us to return to the practice of having people unlock a golem spawner, then upgrade them for an additional cost?
Yes, keeps mining going. Also meshes with the vanilla mechanic of having to build another farm to get more iron.
c. Do you have any further suggestions on how you’d like to see golem souls used?
It'd be fun to have the option to donate them again, I like that.
For this revision, we revealed the custom spawners hidden around the world as bedrock markers, and whether those spawners were in the overworld of nether. This was documented in the public document here.
Following a suggestion-box suggestion, we would like to ask whether you would prefer for all custom spawners to be located in the overworld, rather than shared with the nether?
I'd rather have them all in the overworld. Having a spawner in the nether invites AFK, which reduces the spawnrate for wither skeletons.
Which custom spawners would you like to see in revision 22?
Same as we have, minus the nether spawners.
Which custom spawners would you no longer wish to see in revision 22?
I don't think we need nether spawners.
Guardian grinders became an issue this revision with their spawning rates conflicting with each other and other grinders. If possible, would you like to see a number of guardian spawners introduced to replace generated guardian spawning areas?
I'm not familiar with the issue, I won't chime in.
This revision, we continued publishing blog posts throughout the revision. So far we have published two of a total four, where the final blog post will go out at the end of the revision as a wrap-up.
Is there anything in the blog post you’d like to see more of?
I like the infographics, and the first blog post is fun since it shows off all the cities. I think the last blog of each revision should show the cities again, with an eye on showing off progress since the first post.
Is there anything in the blog post that you’d like to see less of?
Nothing really, I like what's being done
We have continued to introduce a number of small and large events this revision, with the aim to have more available in the second half of the revision to give you more reasons to log back in and return.
How have you found the events so far?
Great! The Knight's Quests were probably the most fun (and frustration, but it's a game, if it's not hard it's not fun) I've had on the server in a long time. That kind of event, or something like it, needs to make a comeback next rev.
Which events would you like to see more of?
More quests! More seek-and-find, more big, map-spanning puzzles and adventures that make you explore.
Which events would you like to see less of?
It's all fun, keep it all
Balancing prizes is something we always take as much care as possible with, depending on the nature of the event and how far through the revision we are.
a. Those two important points aside though, which prizes would you like to see introduced in future events?
This is part of some thoughts on elytra I'll expand on below, but I think that elytra need to be made much harder to obtain. Make them prizes for a particularly hard quest or event, so people have an incentive to actually explore the server instead of jetting around to where they need to go and not actually seeing what the community has to offer.
This revision saw the introduction of the plugin TrainCarts. We included this plugin based on your feedback last revision. We implemented this plugin in a heavily restricted version (so none of this), keeping it reasonably close to HyperCarts, which we were using previously. We appreciate that this was a new plugin, with some hiccups throughout, so thank you for reporting issues to us as they came up.
How have you found the TrainCarts plugin?
Useful, I like the added functionality but I don't use much of it.
Would you like us to continue using this plugin?
I like anything that makes rails easier to build and use.
Are there any other features of TrainCarts that you would like us to explore using?
Not really, what we have seems to work.
Revision 21 also saw the implementation of changes to existing plugins, such as the /place overhaul that pez252 brought us, which was introduced from the back of a suggestionbox suggestion.
Which changes to existing plugins have you found welcome?
N/A at this time
Which changes to existing plugins would you like to see further changes to, or even removal of?
N/A, things seem fine
We are now passing the halfway point in the revision and look forward to seeing you on P with whichever projects you’re working on.
Thank you ever so much for being a fantastic community!
I've really enjoyed this rev, more than the last one. Last rev, at least to me, felt like a let down because a lot of what I really enjoyed about PvE was encroached upon by the presence of elytra. These wings kill communities. They kill the incentive structure that made earlier revisions a real community effort. Before wings, we built great, map-spanning rail systems. Remember CARBON? That was the greatest collaborative engineering project I've ever seen. Roads were big too, and every major city had a land route to every other. Even when wings were first introduced, they weren't too much of a cancer on the server. They were glide-only. Yes, bowflight was a thing, but for the most part people glided off of flight towers and mountains. This meant that one still had to plan a route to get somewhere. If I wanted to go from Rev17 Raven Rock to somewhere down south, I had to glide to Rose, take the rails up their spiral tower, and fly from there. Bowflight was an option, but it wasn't reliable compared to the firework propulsion we have now, and it had a detrimental effect on health. When elytra flight became powered, the wings destroyed any need to build roads or rails. In Rev20, the only reason we even had a major road system was the Continental Route that Zarton_ built on his own. Without their hard work, horses would have been basically useless for long-distance travel. Rev20 rails were dead. No big spawn station. One or two towns with more than one connection. WIngs were and are too easy to get. This rev, rails have come back because the admins created a station. It's been a success, and one can traverse the whole map without wings. I don't think wings need to be removed altogether, but they need to be much harder to get. Essence of flight should be a drop that comes from flying mobs alone particularly ones that don't come from a special spawner. Only the ender dragon should give you a realistic chance of getting an EoF on the first try, and, as I mentioned above, the ender dragon fight needs to be a really difficult boss battle that takes way more prep than it does now. The dragon dies within the first 24 hours of the server being up, without fail every revision. It'd be much more interesting if the dragon could only realistically be killed with max-enchant armor and weapons. It should be a fight that players will fail at unless they either get really good at it, or show up with enough friends to kill it. If this isn't implemented, then we need to seriously consider reverting elytra to unpowered flight only. Gliding between cities is a balanced mechanic. It encourages map knowledge, infrastructure building in the form of flight towers, and makes exploration more fun and feasible than simply jetting off to y500 and not seeing the ground until you dive into your destination. Either way, we need to significantly reduce how powerful elytra are.
Edit: 2 posts from the subreddit regarding elytra balancing that I think deserve further attention: