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Revision 21: Mid-Revision Feedback Topic

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It’s that time of the revision again! With a new year, we enter 2018 requesting your feedback in this mid-rev feedback topic. The current revision is set to last until at least March 2018, we will continue to announce a reset date, one month in advance.

What is the point of this topic?

The bottom line for this topic is that we use your feedback to shape the next revision. While we also look at historical feedback across the prior revisions, this topic is one of the most significant sources of your feedback that forms the basis of our detailed planning for the next revision. Until this topic closes and your feedback is within, we do not have any decisions set in stone.

 

Notes

Please assume that every section has a “Do you have any additional thoughts?” question within. We welcome feedback that isn’t confined to the questions we are asking. At the bottom of the post in spoiler tags, there will be a template for you to copy and paste, to respond to each point easier.

This topic will be open until January 21st and we will be taking responses up to and including that date! Here are some important dates to note for this topic:

January 13th - Padmins will do the first round of responses to everyone in the topic.

January 20th - Padmins will do the second and final round of responses to everyone in the topic.

January 21st - The topic will close, a day after.

 

Expectations

From the start of the revision, we set up our expectations of how the revision would play out, including for the first time ever, an estimated timeline for the revision duration.

  1. How are you finding this revision, knowing the revision duration in advance?
  2. We gave a rough outline for having more events in the latter half of the revision. Would you like more information along these lines in future?
  3. We made it clear that we wanted to involve you more in the decision making, and did just that with various events and tasks this revision. This involved the pve survey, a poll for the admin hunt location, the death message update and a number of suggestionbox submissions which were implemented.

a. We want to continue down this path, and do more. How do you feel we did so far and what more can we look to do?

 

Map

Size

For revision 21, the map size is 9000 x 9000 blocks. We have been considering a smaller overworld map for revision 22, as confirmed in the discussion here.

  1. How have you found the current map size?
  2. We believe that returning to a smaller map size for next revision would encourage more community activity - something we are strongly looking to promote. What are your thoughts?

 

Biomes

We used the Open Terrain Generator to generate the map and worldpainter to make smaller changes. This terrain generator allows for a variation in the types of biomes and allows us to modify them too before they generate, and worldpainter lets us make more precise changes on a smaller scale by comparison.

  1. How have you found the world generated?
  2. Which biomes would you like to see more of?
  3. Which biomes would you like to see less of?

 

Ore Distribution

For the ore distribution this revision, we emulated the values of revision 19 (though there are notable differences). Additionally, compared to last revision, ores would typically generate where you’d expect to find them normally.

  1. How did you find the ore generation this revision?
  2. Were there any ores you feel were too sparse?
  3. Were there any ores you feel were too abundant?
  4. Would you like to see biomes specific ores such as the mesa being plumped for gold?

 

Nether Portals

For this map size, we spread 12 nether portal markers out around the map, with another nether portal at spawn. Each nether portal could be lit within 100 blocks of the marker, and placed in either the upper, or lower nether.

  1. We meticulously planned the bedrock markers to try to provide optimum coverage. How did you find the layout for this revision?
  2. Given that we are considering a smaller map size, how would you like to see the volume and layout of nether portals?

 

Nether

This revision, we saw the nether divided into an upper nether, which was all entirely custom built by Sir_Didymus, and the lower nether being vanilla generation, with the bedrock roof mostly removed between the two.

  1. Would you like to see an upper nether return again, or shall we explore another format (such as an all-vanilla nether)?
  2. We introduced a nether spawn this revision, which was built by Barlimore, Sir_Didymus and with staff contributions. We did this to introduce people to the upper/lower nether concept.

a. Provided there is an upper nether again; Would you like a nether spawn to return in future, or would you like us to return to tradition and allow you to create your own nether spawn?

b. How did you find having a pre-built nether rail station?

 

End

It’s the end! This world is typically generated completely vanilla. For this revision, the end was a size of 4500 x 4500.

  1. How do you feel about the size of the end? Should this be smaller?
  2. We have frequently heard feedback about wanting the end dragon fight made more difficult. How would you feel about the end dragon fight being a non-vanilla experience?

 

Mapworld

This revision, mapworld carried over from revision 20, allowing you to keep your plots, maps and modreq for them again without losing your work! We plan to bring mapworld over into revision 22 too.

  1. How have you found the experience of mapworld carrying over into the new revision?
  2. Which changes would you like to see to mapworld, if any? Worldedit has been a frequent request and an example which we would love to hear feedback upon.

 

Spawn

The overworld spawn this revision was curated by defiex, decorated by staff and built by jar9. We confirmed early this rev that the spawn building for revision 22 would be entirely built by nerd staff. With that in mind, we've made early progress on the spawn structure, to ensure a timely completion, and have made sure it fits well with the theme and events planned for revision 22.

  1. We have aimed for a very simple layout, one where you can exit spawn swiftly and clearly, along one of four cardinal roads. We are looking to further mitigate lag at spawn by moving the nether portal away from the spawn point.

a. What would you expect to see from the layout of spawn next revision?

        2. Which was your favourite Easter egg around spawn this revision?

        3. Are there any spawn ideas you’d like to submit for future?

        4. How did you find having a pre-built spawn rail station?


 

Features

Iron Golem Spawners

This revision, we replaced the wither skull cost from iron golem spawners and replaced it with a 1/500 chance of naturally generated iron ore of dropping a ‘golem soul’. We continued the practice of having these spawner costs lower each month, to make them more accessible to those outside of towns.

  1. More than 1000 golem souls have been mined in the revision so far, resulting in iron golem spawners bought swiftly and with spare golem souls going towards a community contribution for special villagers.

a. How would you like to see the iron golem spawner costs adjusted for the next revision?

b. Would you like us to return to the practice of having people unlock a golem spawner, then upgrade them for an additional cost?

c. Do you have any further suggestions on how you’d like to see golem souls used?

Custom Spawners

For this revision, we revealed the custom spawners hidden around the world as bedrock markers, and whether those spawners were in the overworld of nether. This was documented in the public document here.

  1. Following a suggestion-box suggestion, we would like to ask whether you would prefer for all custom spawners to be located in the overworld, rather than shared with the nether?
  2. Which custom spawners would you like to see in revision 22?
  3. Which custom spawners would you no longer wish to see in revision 22?
  4. Guardian grinders became an issue this revision with their spawning rates conflicting with each other and other grinders. If possible, would you like to see a number of guardian spawners introduced to replace generated guardian spawning areas?

 

Community

Blog Posts

This revision, we continued publishing blog posts throughout the revision. So far we have published two of a total four, where the final blog post will go out at the end of the revision as a wrap-up.

  1. Is there anything in the blog post you’d like to see more of?
  2. Is there anything in the blog post that you’d like to see less of?

Events

We have continued to introduce a number of small and large events this revision, with the aim to have more available in the second half of the revision to give you more reasons to log back in and return.

  1. How have you found the events so far?
  2. Which events would you like to see more of?
  3. Which events would you like to see less of?
  4. Balancing prizes is something we always take as much care as possible with, depending on the nature of the event and how far through the revision we are.

a. Those two important points aside though, which prizes would you like to see introduced in future events?

 

Plugins

TrainCarts

This revision saw the introduction of the plugin TrainCarts. We included this plugin based on your feedback last revision. We implemented this plugin in a heavily restricted version (so none of this), keeping it reasonably close to HyperCarts, which we were using previously. We appreciate that this was a new plugin, with some hiccups throughout, so thank you for reporting issues to us as they came up.

  1. How have you found the TrainCarts plugin?
  2. Would you like us to continue using this plugin?
  3. Are there any other features of TrainCarts that you would like us to explore using?

Other Plugins

Revision 21 also saw the implementation of changes to existing plugins, such as the /place overhaul that pez252 brought us, which was introduced from the back of a suggestionbox suggestion.

  1. Which changes to existing plugins have you found welcome?
  2. Which changes to existing plugins would you like to see further changes to, or even removal of?

 

Closing Thoughts

We are now passing the halfway point in the revision and look forward to seeing you on P with whichever projects you’re working on.

Thank you ever so much for being a fantastic community!

 

Template for responding:

Spoiler

Expectations

1.

2.

3a.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Map

 

Size

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Biomes

1.

2.

3.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Ore Distribution

1.

2.

3.

4.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Nether Portals

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Nether

1.

2a.

2b.

Additional Thoughts:

 

End

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Mapworld

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Spawn

1a.

2.

3.

4.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Features

 

Iron Golem Spawners

1a.

1b.

1c.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Custom Spawners

1.

2.

3.

4.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Community

 

Blog Posts

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Events

1.

2.

3.

4a.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Plugins

 

TrainCarts

1.

2.

3.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Other Plugins

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Closing Thoughts

 

Additional Thoughts:

 

  • Upvote 2

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  1. How are you finding this revision, knowing the revision duration in advance?
  2. We gave a rough outline for having more events in the latter half of the revision. Would you like more information along these lines in future?
  3. We made it clear that we wanted to involve you more in the decision making, and did just that with various events and tasks this revision. This involved the pve survey, a poll for the admin hunt location, the death message update and a number of suggestionbox submissions which were implemented.

a. We want to continue down this path, and do more. How do you feel we did so far and what more can we look to do?

1) It's nice to know the duration in advance. IMO clear set expectations are always better than uncertainty. On that note, the 6 month time frame seems just about right.

2) Stuff like outlines explaining what's upcoming in the near future is always welcome.

3) It seems to me there is a good amount of community involvement. I love the whole suggestionbox situation. I'd be curious to hear what else you guys are thinking of as far as community decision making. I also want to add that while community involvement is great there is also a lot to be said for experienced staff being able to make their own informed decisions regarding gameplay, server management, ect. Community involvement is great. Trusted, experienced, and creative staff being able to implement their vision is also great. Gotta find that elusive sweet spot between secret dev cabal and game management by committee of hundreds. I'd say we're pretty close to that sweet spot now.

4 hours ago, Barlimore said:

For revision 21, the map size is 9000 x 9000 blocks. We have been considering a smaller overworld map for revision 22, as confirmed in the discussion here.

  1. How have you found the current map size?
  2. We believe that returning to a smaller map size for next revision would encourage more community activity - something we are strongly looking to promote. What are your thoughts?

1) I am strongly in favor of large maps. 9kx9k is a wonderful thing! In my opinion cramming the same number of people into a smaller space will potentially lead to an increase in friction and conflicts. On smaller maps everything becomes more scarce, and not in a fun way. There's fewer good spots to build, fewer portals to claim, fewer fun things to find, ect.

2) I'm not sure I see how a smaller map would result in more community activity. Also, what kind of community activities are we talking about? I like what we have on the large map this rev because people have as much space as they need but can still easily visit each other with all the portals, rail, horses, boats, and eletrya. Getting around is pretty easy, even for someone who just joined the server for the first time.

4 hours ago, Barlimore said:

We used the Open Terrain Generator to generate the map and worldpainter to make smaller changes. This terrain generator allows for a variation in the types of biomes and allows us to modify them too before they generate, and worldpainter lets us make more precise changes on a smaller scale by comparison.

  1. How have you found the world generated?
  2. Which biomes would you like to see more of?
  3. Which biomes would you like to see less of?

1) I am in love with this map. It's probably the closest I've ever seen to what in my head is the ideal map. It's a perfect combination of vanilla and creative custom stuff. It doesn't feel predictable or cookie-cutter. Everywhere I go there's fun stuff to discover. Additionally, the terrain "makes sense" to me in that it feels like a product of nature and not a bunch of random cobbled together bits. As far as I'm concerned, do it again! The only issue I've had with map-gen related stuff is custom trees in some biomes whose leaves don't despawn after chopping.

 

4 hours ago, Barlimore said:
  • How did you find the ore generation this revision?
  • Were there any ores you feel were too sparse?
  • Were there any ores you feel were too abundant?
  • Would you like to see biomes specific ores such as the mesa being plumped for gold?

1) Ore generation seemed pretty good. Quartz and glowstone were perfect. Clay was also good. However;

2) Gold is way too rare. Sand is also way way too rare. I'd love to see sand deposits that are similar in size and shape to dirt deposits.

3) Diamonds are too easy to find. Bring F3 into the mix and it's too easy to have blocks of diamonds after a couple days. Same to a lesser extent for lapis and redstone.

4) Biome-specific ores and such would be awesome!! Anything that differentiates various areas of the map beyond cosmetic changes is good.

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:
  • We meticulously planned the bedrock markers to try to provide optimum coverage. How did you find the layout for this revision?
  • Given that we are considering a smaller map size, how would you like to see the volume and layout of nether portals?

1) I think the layout is perfect.

2) A proportional shrinking of the number of portals would probably be fine but I really hope you reconsider the smaller map.

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

This revision, we saw the nether divided into an upper nether, which was all entirely custom built by Sir_Didymus, and the lower nether being vanilla generation, with the bedrock roof mostly removed between the two.

  1. Would you like to see an upper nether return again, or shall we explore another format (such as an all-vanilla nether)?
  2. We introduced a nether spawn this revision, which was built by Barlimore, Sir_Didymus and with staff contributions. We did this to introduce people to the upper/lower nether concept.

a. Provided there is an upper nether again; Would you like a nether spawn to return in future, or would you like us to return to tradition and allow you to create your own nether spawn?

b. How did you find having a pre-built nether rail station?

1) I'll be brutally honest- I've found the dual-layer nether to be confusing. I still don't really get it. It makes it hard for me to understand where I am in relation to other landmarks in the nether. I think I'd prefer a single layer nether. I think custom terrain is great, but just one layer of it.

2) The nether spawn is beautiful for sure. The rail station is also real nice. However, I like limiting as much as possible the prebuilt stuff included in the map. It's convenient and pretty but it kinda feels like cheating. 

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

It’s the end! This world is typically generated completely vanilla. For this revision, the end was a size of 4500 x 4500.

  1. How do you feel about the size of the end? Should this be smaller?
  2. We have frequently heard feedback about wanting the end dragon fight made more difficult. How would you feel about the end dragon fight being a non-vanilla experience?

1) End size seems fine. I wouldn't mind a foray into custom end terrain. Seems like it could be real fun and different.

2) Non-vanilla dragon fight sounds awesome. Bring the pain!

 

I'm not familiar with mapworld, so I'll leave that one.

 

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

Spawn

The overworld spawn this revision was curated by defiex, decorated by staff and built by jar9. We confirmed early this rev that the spawn building for revision 22 would be entirely built by nerd staff. With that in mind, we've made early progress on the spawn structure, to ensure a timely completion, and have made sure it fits well with the theme and events planned for revision 22.

  1. We have aimed for a very simple layout, one where you can exit spawn swiftly and clearly, along one of four cardinal roads. We are looking to further mitigate lag at spawn by moving the nether portal away from the spawn point.

a. What would you expect to see from the layout of spawn next revision?

        2. Which was your favourite Easter egg around spawn this revision?

        3. Are there any spawn ideas you’d like to submit for future?

        4. How did you find having a pre-built spawn rail station?

1) I like to see a linear progression of all the stuff you need to expose people to in spawn as opposed to having it all just in a room to browse or something similar. There's always a lot going on in spawn, especially in that early rev rush, so the less people have to look around and figure stuff out the better. Point them in the right direction, expose them to what they need to see as they travel in that direction, then clear clean exit.

2) I loved the Monty Python stuff up in the towers!

3) Don't have anything on deck at the moment but who knows going forward.

4) Like I said with the nether spawn- pre-built infrastructure is nice in that it's convenient and looks good but in general I like to avoid as much pre-built stuff as possible. Having a full supercomputer station on day one is slightly less impressive/less engaging with the community than something similar being build organically in survival mode. That all being said the station is beautiful and does its job very very well

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

This revision, we replaced the wither skull cost from iron golem spawners and replaced it with a 1/500 chance of naturally generated iron ore of dropping a ‘golem soul’. We continued the practice of having these spawner costs lower each month, to make them more accessible to those outside of towns.

  1. More than 1000 golem souls have been mined in the revision so far, resulting in iron golem spawners bought swiftly and with spare golem souls going towards a community contribution for special villagers.

a. How would you like to see the iron golem spawner costs adjusted for the next revision?

b. Would you like us to return to the practice of having people unlock a golem spawner, then upgrade them for an additional cost?

c. Do you have any further suggestions on how you’d like to see golem souls used?

1a) I don't build iron grinder so I don't really have an informed opinion on their cost.

1b) Same ^

1c) I LOVE finding golem souls. For some reason they make mining for iron fun. I don't do anything except put them in a box but I sure as shit love finding them. The sound. The shiny little soul-thing. The rush of wondering if the next iron block is a winner. Keep the mechanic! I'd love some more trading options or something so we can still use them even if we're not building grinders.

 

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

For this revision, we revealed the custom spawners hidden around the world as bedrock markers, and whether those spawners were in the overworld of nether. This was documented in the public document here.

  1. Following a suggestion-box suggestion, we would like to ask whether you would prefer for all custom spawners to be located in the overworld, rather than shared with the nether?
  2. Which custom spawners would you like to see in revision 22?
  3. Which custom spawners would you no longer wish to see in revision 22?
  4. Guardian grinders became an issue this revision with their spawning rates conflicting with each other and other grinders. If possible, would you like to see a number of guardian spawners introduced to replace generated guardian spawning areas?

1) I think spawners should live in the dimension their creature comes from. Spawners for overworld mobs in overworld, nether mobs in nether, ect.

2) Do we have pigman spawners? I think that would be nice instead of the platform grinder thing. Custom spawners for all the things are fun. Keep em all, add the ones we don't have yet! Let's get a bat spawner up in here.

3) Keep them all!

4) Don't have any experience with guardians so I'll sit that one out.

 

No offense to you guys that work hard on the blog but I'm not really interested. Haven't checked it out yet. It's a great resource for the community though, I'm glad it's there.

 

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

We have continued to introduce a number of small and large events this revision, with the aim to have more available in the second half of the revision to give you more reasons to log back in and return.

  1. How have you found the events so far?
  2. Which events would you like to see more of?
  3. Which events would you like to see less of?
  4. Balancing prizes is something we always take as much care as possible with, depending on the nature of the event and how far through the revision we are.

a. Those two important points aside though, which prizes would you like to see introduced in future events?

1) I've really enjoyed the events so far this rev.

2) I want to see more non combat related events!

3) We don't need less of anything. More events=more fun.

4) Custom/rare things. Stuff that's not necessarily useful but is super rare/not found at all in survival. If there's any way to do custom cosmetics I think that would be a lot of fun too. Things like clothes/armor/whatever or particle effects like in the lobby.

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

This revision saw the introduction of the plugin TrainCarts. We included this plugin based on your feedback last revision. We implemented this plugin in a heavily restricted version (so none of this), keeping it reasonably close to HyperCarts, which we were using previously. We appreciate that this was a new plugin, with some hiccups throughout, so thank you for reporting issues to us as they came up.

  1. How have you found the TrainCarts plugin?
  2. Would you like us to continue using this plugin?
  3. Are there any other features of TrainCarts that you would like us to explore using?

1) I haven't used it much but what I have done with it has been fun.

2) Yeah, I'd say keep it! It's the kind of thing that seems like it should already be in vanilla.

3) Not familiar with the plugin outside of what we do with it so I'm not sure.

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

Revision 21 also saw the implementation of changes to existing plugins, such as the /place overhaul that pez252 brought us, which was introduced from the back of a suggestionbox suggestion.

  1. Which changes to existing plugins have you found welcome?
  2. Which changes to existing plugins would you like to see further changes to, or even removal of?

1) I'm not sure what exactly has been changing but I find myself enjoying all the plugins I encounter while playing and haven't had any issues.

2) I'm happy with things as they stand.

5 hours ago, Barlimore said:

Closing Thoughts

We are now passing the halfway point in the revision and look forward to seeing you on P with whichever projects you’re working on.

Thank you ever so much for being a fantastic community!

:wub:

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Expectations

1. Knowing the rough duration in advance helps me manage my expectations and ambitions for my personal and community projects.

2. Yes! Learning about upcoming events was one of the many things that has been keeping me engaged this revision.

3a. I just want to scream 'bravo' because you all are doing amazing work! All the creativity and technical expertise poured into this server by the staff is what makes it so great, and it is really welcoming to see our feedback and ideas being considered in the development of each rev to grow along that vision.

Additional Thoughts:
I just want to add that this is the first revision in which I was able to experience almost the full extent of it. I have joined two previous revs almost two years ago for short periods of time, but I am not going to be able to compare this revision to the previous ones since back then it was difficult for me to understand, navigate the map or even be an active participant in the community due to my poor english.


Map


Size

1. & 2. I don't have many comments about the map size since I don't have many references, but this map size seemed good to me. It was easy to travel around once I got a horse, the portals are great shortcuts and the rails have been very useful to me. I also felt that even if the people were quite far, they were still willing to help and provide tools or materials to those in need and participate in each other's events. I am really curious to try a smaller map though, mostly because my lack of experience leads me to wonder what would change with it, so take my comments with a grain of salt.

Biomes

1. I love the custom biomes! The extra structures are also very fun to explore.

2. I think there was a good balance achieved. 

Ore Distribution

1. Good! I remember spending the first weeks just mining and mining and mining... Not because I was that desperate, but because it was really rewarding. All the ores, the extra sand and extra glowstone, the golem souls...

2. I felt gold was very difficult to find, or maybe I was just unlucky!

3. Nop!

4. Yes! Not only it would make travelling as a solo player more interesting, but I can imagine it sparking even more ideas for themed towns or similar community builds.

Nether Portals

1. Perfect coverage!

2. To be reduced, at least one near each corner and the center.

Nether

1. I liked it a lot. It took me a couple days to learn how to navigate both levels, but I enjoyed the feeling of aliveness embedded to it, if I can make sense, like the nether was a world with as much history as the overworld instead of just being a desert land mined for resources only.

2a. The nether spawn was essential for me to learn how to differentiate and navigate between the two levels.

2b. The station and the rail itself was very useful to me as a customer (:P), but since I am not involved with building rails, at least not for now, I don't know how essential it is to have it pre-build at the nether spawn.

End

1. I haven't explored the end much yet.

2. I fought the dragon for the first time ever this rev! I had someone guiding me through the fight and that made the experience less frightening to me (I was pretty scared!), but I can see how the fight itself can be monotonous for more experienced players, especially when the dragon gets stuck in the portal and you just have to hit it. I am open to a non-vanilla dragon!

Mapworld

1. I haven't experienced this particular feature since I didn't participate last revision, but it sounds great! I do have some questions though and I am not sure if this is the right place to ask them: do all the maps get carried over or only the ones we want to carry over do?

2. I am pretty content with what the mapworld allow us to do right now, I like to feel that I worked a bit to create my maps even though it is already on creative and my maps are quite simple, but if other players would find worldedit useful I am open to it too.

Additional Thoughts:
Can I say that I LOVE the mapworld? I discovered it this rev and I am completely obsessed with creating little pixel art paintings with it!
 

Spawn

1a. Your current aims are my expectations!

2. This spawn is so appetizing that I have come back to it many times just to explore around. I am also in no rush to find all the secrets immediately because I have been enjoying it a lot to just stumble on them! Is the evil bunny cave an easter egg? I had a good chuckle when I fell into that one with my horse :)

3. A town/castle made by giants in the mountains where we are the little people. Or a giant vegetable garden... mmh... did you notice a theme here?

4. My answer to this one is the same as the nether rail station one!

Features


Iron Golem Spawners

1a. & 1b. I don't have something to add since I haven't tried to build an iron golem spawner.

1c. I really like the current uses for the golem souls, but I don't have further suggestions yet. 

Custom Spawners

1. I like how the spawners in the nether encouraged me to explore the nether a lot more than if they were created in the overworld. Taking them out would rob the nether of some of the most unique things it has. I do understand how afking at these spawners can negatively affect people hunting for loot of specifics mobs in other areas though, and to me this seems like a difficult balance to achieve.

2. I don't know what other kind of spawners would be helpful. The current ones are great and the squid one was particularly useful to me.

3. I would like to see all of them again next rev!

4. I am not familiar with guardian grinders aside from using the ones other players' build, I am afraid I can't contribute with anything valuable to this particular question.


Community

Blog Posts

1. & 2. No suggestions but:


Additional Thoughts: I love blog posts... I always did! As a player that is only now trying to get more involved with the community, they were a good introduction for me to learn more about the server, what has happened and what is being planned for the future. Keep them coming! The facts, interviews and community sections are particularly enjoyable to read.

Events

1. Incredibly engaging, fun, challenging, and an awesome way to explore the map.

2. Any of the ideas you guys are currently brewing in there!

3. No! I want all the events! All of them!

4a. The prizes have been more than I could have imagined so far, from the cosmetics to the armor, tools, weapons, books and spawn eggs, I have treasured all of them! I don't know if this is the right place to share it, but when the christmas event begun and people started to find the maps I created for the event, I received some of the most lovely and encouraging messages (thank you! <3). The players that wrote me seemed very pleased with the custom maps as souvenirs and prizes, and even those that usually do not like custom maps because of their over-detailed nature, they enjoyed these for being more simple. I know a map was used for the Prophecy, but maybe maps could be used as prizes too? Or a picture you have to complete and you get a piece every time you finish a quest? If there's a need for more hands I would be more than happy to help create them, even though I don't know how feasible it is in practical terms or how it would affect the server.

Plugins

TrainCarts

1. & 2. & 3. I am not familiar with this plugin even though I use the rails constantly! From what I can experience, it works wonderfully and I would keep it.

Other Plugins

1. & 2. I can't pinpoint particular plugins since I am still learning a lot, but the plugins, alongside the community, maps and events, are a very important part of my experience on this server! I don't have any suggestions.

Closing Thoughts

Thank you so much for creating and keeping alive this amazing server!

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I have found that Wickedcoolsteves comments almost exact to my rough draft, so I will state that he speaks for me, with these additions:

  I will add that at this point I usually have built all my planned builds and I just explore.  This revision I am still finding stuff under ground.  Whether intended or not, mining is a trouble point.  there are interuptive cave systems, odd deposits and such.  AND I LOVE IT !!  getting a run that is stone, with a few findings is rare, it makes mining adventurous as it should be.

I love the special events.  I have found that mid rev it seems there is still interest in the Adventurers Guild, nicely placed and done.  though I know what that takes.

 

mid rev score remains as it was upon initial finding...11/10 

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Expectations

1. I like knowing a rough end date. It makes it easier to know how long i have to AFK in my farm :)

2. yes

3a. Its hard to find a good mix of "public input" vs "getting things done timely" - I think you're on the right track.

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Map

Size

1. I like the current map size. It allows people to build far away from eachother without having to worry about encroaching. It also means that you can often find a large area to mine resources without having to worry about marring the view for a neighbor

2. ^ point 1 aside, i think we've been trending towards larger and larger maps recently. A smaller map may encourage more built infrastructure (roads, rails, etc). 

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Biomes

1. The deviation from vanilla is great.

2. sand and gravel deposits/deserts. Especially with the new concrete - i hate having to tear up beaches for concrete since they're often quite close to others builds. And with the ocean floor not being sand/gravel this rev its not as easy to do.

3. n/a

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Ore Distribution

1. Seemed to be pretty decently distributed. Diamonds do seem a bit high but its a hard ore to get perfect.

2. nope

3. diamond a smidge. otherwise nope.

4. Mesa being plumped for gold is vanilla now iirc. And extreme hills are emeralds. Seems like a good idea if you're looking for something rather than lowering ratios overall.

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Nether Portals

1. I personally prefer a sligthly more spread out portal spread, but i dont think this revs set up was bad. 

2. TBH i would absolutely love to see a new method of portal distribution tried. This method is 'tried and true' but it does often seem like the same groups get portals. In a perfect world, a method for 'purchasing' a portal would be amazing - provided there are no obstacles on the overworld/netherside of the coordinates the only limit on this would be having them too close together (which could be easily mitigated by setting rules regarding distance between portals etc). 

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Nether

1. Vanilla nether is boring. But this revs upper/lower made it hard to figure out where portals were located.

2a. Personally i am a huge fan of "no staff created builds other than main spawn" in a map. Its convenient, but really feels like too much is just handed out when it happens. 

2b. Same as above. Its a nice station, but i would rather it not be pre-built. 

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

End

1. I dont really use the end. I've only been a handful of times this rev since i found an end portal. 

2. ^ I've no real opinion on this. 

Additional Thoughts: There's just not enough in the end to make it worth my time to go. I'd be all for nuking the vanilla end and doing something more fun.

 

Mapworld

1. I've not used mapworld *this* rev, but having the maps carry forward. It gives you a chance to work on a larger project and not feel like its wasted time if you finish the week before a new rev. 

2. World edit feels a bit too cheaty. Its already creative mode on a pve server which is strike 1. 

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Spawn

1a. I think the layout is fine. Its easy enough to navigate.

2. n/a

3. n/a

4. Same as the nether station. the fewer pre-built staff items the better.

Additional Thoughts: FLOWERCOPTER SPAWN IS BEST SPAWN

 

Features

Iron Golem Spawners

1a. i think costs are fine

1b. I prefer the level-up method. It lets you get started quicker rather than jumping straight to the end. 

1c.  n/a

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Custom Spawners

1. I agree with WCS, i like mobs to live in the world where they exist. that being said, nether spawners are just bad news (see additional thoughts) 

2. 'same old same old'

3. zigs.

4. The problem with guardian grinders this rev is that there are way too many temples. A normal map (with normal mob distributions) would never have as many as we do, and with everyone and their cousin wanting to make a grinder of it, all it is going to do is make us hit the hostile mob cap more often and break things. that being said, i DO NOT think we should replace them with spawners. guardian temples work just fine as a natural spawner, they just need to be limited to more normal levels. 

Additional Thoughts: Nether spawners imo are a bad idea - It encourages afking in a world that already has spawning issues if players are split. This often leads to extremely salty players wanting to know who is in the nether and getting mad when people AFK there and divide the mob count.

 

Community

Blog Posts

1. I really liked the blog post that had the 'list of towns/coords' on it. For uh...mapping reasons :)

2. nope.

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Events

1. I die a lot. Though i think its intentional.

2. no real opinion. all events are good events.

3. no real opinion. all events are good events.

4a. i dont get prizes :( 

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Plugins

TrainCarts

1. I have had so many problems with TrainCarts at this point i wont even use rails anymore. I can't use elytra because my internet can't keep up with the server if i'm moving that fast. And now I can't use rails for the same reason (hypercarts allowed you to set your own max speed so i could make it usable). I end up lagging into lava or walls or off cliffs, I constantly take damage on corners due to the way it moves you across the track. Additionally it messes with auto-furnaces that use carts so we're stuck using hopper-heavy methods. Overall - no sir. I dont like it. 

2. pls god no. 

3. just the one feature where you dont use it at all.

Additional Thoughts: n/a

 

Other Plugins

1. n/a

2. n/a

Additional Thoughts: We've discussed the other area i have noticed issues. no further comments here.

 

Closing Thoughts: nope

 

Additional Thoughts: nope

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Expectations

1. I definitely enjoy knowing the duration in advance. It gives me a better idea of how much time is remaining so I can adjust my ambitiousness accordingly. I ran into time issues last revision (even with the one-month reset notice) and unfortunately did not finish Haven Tower nearly to the extent that I wanted.

2. I certainly like knowing that at least one more event is coming in the second half of the revision.

3a. I do think that the padmin team has done a much better job involving players in decision-making this revision compared to the previous revision while still maintaining an air of mystery where it matters most (i.e. overall theme, map style).

Additional Thoughts: In hindsight, I feel the TrainCarts addition was a bit rushed but I will elaborate more on that in the appropriate section below. I wanted to note it here as I feel it applies to this category as well.
 
Map
 
Size

1. I’m neutral on the current map size. Not bad, but not great. Lots of opportunities to explore, but sometimes it seems too large.

2. I agree that a smaller map could help reach that goal. I support this idea.

Additional Thoughts: None at this time!
 
Biomes

1. Really well done! I love the vast ocean in the south and not just because it played perfectly into Haven’s theme for this revision ;). I do think there are WAY too many ocean monuments. I cannot stress that enough. Regardless of the issues that occurred earlier in the revision (w.r.t. guardian spawning), having more than two guardian grinders is a bit absurd and unnecessary in practicality. I was able to set Haven’s grinder apart from the others by introducing an XP mode feature and I am very happy to say that we receive a lot of traffic because of it. How could you turn down the opportunity to repair a diamond pickaxe with two swipes of a sword?!

2. This revision, I noticed quite a few biomes that looked copied and pasted from last revision. That’s certainly not to say that “repeats” shouldn’t be expected, but a lot of the “oooh, aaaah” allure didn’t return. Personally, I’d encourage the rev 22 map maker to take a little artistic license with the OTG configuration!

3. For the love of all that is Good and Pure in this universe, please turn off Birch Forests. Please!

Additional Thoughts: None at this time.
 
Ore Distribution

1. Better, compared to last revision. I would rather ores be too plentiful than too scarce.

2. Nether Quartz (and even Glowstone) could use a bit of a boost.

3. Diamond Ore is too abundant for my liking.

4. Yes!

Additional Thoughts: None at this time.
 
Nether Portals

1. If coverage was your objective, I think it was met with flying colors. I have not found myself wishing for an extra nether portal in any location this revision.

2. In my opinion, nether portal quantity should scale proportionally with map size.

Additional Thoughts: I wonder if it might be worth reconsidering a previous suggestion I made to allow players to create their own portals (with restrictions). I’ll try to find that post.
 
Nether

1. I enjoyed the upper nether tremendously, and I think Didy did a fantastic job with it. That being said, I do not want to see a dual-level nether again. I feel very strongly about this. It caused too many problems with mob spawning in nether fortresses, which was already a sore area. The community answered by creating the UMC hunting grounds, but the scale of that project should not have been necessary.

2a. This is a bit of a toss-up for me. On one hand, a pre-built spawn takes away the opportunity for a player to contribute in a very significant way by building it. On the other hand, it ensures we have a nice-looking spawn and not something… well… derp-y.

2b. I was a bit iffy on both the overworld spawn station and the nether spawn station while discussions were being had before the revision launched. My opinion may be unpopular but I am still not convinced they are necessary, especially with the improvement in Gold Ore distribution.

Additional Thoughts: None at this time.
 
End

1. I think the size is fine. It is large enough for a decent number of End Cities to generate, so players like me (who enjoy the thrill/difficulty) have the opportunity to raid one to obtain a “legit” Elytra. Most players don’t leave the main island anyway.

2. I support the dragon fight being a non-vanilla experience as long as it is tested thoroughly far enough in advance for (at least) staff members to offer feedback.

Additional Thoughts: I’d also like to put forward the suggestion of re-generating the outer end islands on a repeating cycle in order to eliminate the Essence of Flight recipe for Elytra.
 
Mapworld

1. I am very happy that Mapworld carried over.

2. WorldEdit, please! I know there are some purists who start shaking their fist at the nearest cloud whenever WorldEdit is suggested (“back in my day we didn’t have creative mode and you had to walk FIFTEEN MILES with your inventory full!!!”), but it would be such a huge help to be able to do a quick //replace to generate large planes of the same block. I personally have a very hard time using mapworld for this reason due to a medical issue, but I wish I could make more mapart. I know concerns were voiced regarding the ability for players to do serious damage if something were to go awry during a command, but the region permissions that C uses to control WorldEdit work perfectly fine. Barli, I’m going to suggest this every time a feedback post comes up if I have to! ;)

Additional Thoughts: every time barli (!)
 
Spawn

1a. Spawn was much clearer this time! I don’t have any suggestions for the next spawn, as I think that’s one of the parts of the map that should remain shrouded in secrecy to preserve excitement.

2. I am going to skip this question as I participated in spawn sprucing this revision.

3. See Spawn #1a above.

4. See Nether #2b above.

Additional Thoughts: I strongly support the return to 100%-staff-built spawns.
 
Features
 
Iron Golem Spawners

1a. I would like to see a return to Emerald-Ore-as-currency.

1b. Yes.

1c. For the remainder of the revision? Maybe another set of traders. For next revision? I’d like to see them replaced with the Emerald Ore system.

Additional Thoughts: None at this time.
 
Custom Spawners

1. Yes. I do not support custom spawners in the Nether. Most players do not take the time to spawn-proof the area around their Nether grinders, and that causes a huge problem with spawning in other parts of the Nether (i.e. fortresses). Moreover, the custom spawners are not really necessary: you can easily hunt Zombie Pigmen at a fortress platform, and Ghasts are really not that difficult to hunt either.

2. Squid, Slime, Creeper

3. Witch, Zombie Pigman, Ghast

4. No. Limit the number of Ocean Monuments that spawn on the map instead. I would be disappointed to see guardian spawners, as it then becomes more about luck than skill/perseverance. 

Additional Thoughts: None at this time.
 
Community
 
Blog Posts

1. More stats!

2. Nope!

Additional Thoughts: None at this time.
 
Events

1. The Thanksgiving event was a bit lackluster. It fell a bit flat in the beginning due to the prizes only consisting of trophies, and even after more prizes were added, some were a bit… strange… like the Looting 3 book. I don't see much incentive for a player to spend their Wishbones on a L3 book when they could buy one for a couple emeralds (by extension, pumpkins) instead. Those turkeys are a gigantic pain in the butt dangerous, and if players are going to be forced to interact with them (which they are, since they replaced hostile mobs) then the prizes should reflect that level of difficulty. I do not think they did this revision.

The Knight’s Quest is great. Some really cool people must’ve created that event ;).

The New Year’s event was different, and in a good way! I liked it.

2. Some more mini-events like the New Year’s one would be great for mob-skull-hunters like myself!

3. The Thanksgiving event could use some re-thinking for next year. Breathe some life back into it. :)

4a. I think the prizes for the Knights Quest were fair — it’s a difficult event to finish and the enchantments reflected that. Maybe consider offering a book with both Infinity and Mending, a Feather Falling 5 book, a Looting 5, and/or a Fortune 5 book as (a) top-tier prize(s) for a future event. Nothing crazy, nothing overly OP, but still something worth the time investment. 

Additional Thoughts: I’d like to see a return to the Pick Your Own style that was used in the Adventurer’s Guild last revision. I really liked that idea!
 
Plugins
 
TrainCarts

1. It’s a double-edged sword. It adds some cool functionality like the pressure plate junctions and the speed boost, but it’s very glitchy. Players clipping walls and taking damage, carts phasing through the ground, carts magically levitating, carts not launching when a powered rail is powered, carts losing all momentum and stopping when making a jump from one powered rail to another powered rail, etc.

2. I wonder if totemo would find it feasible add some of the better functionality (like pressure plate junctions) to HyperCarts. I understand that would take some rewriting of the minecart physics, so I emphasize the word “feasible” here.

3. I don’t think so. I think the features chosen for this revision are the limit on what’s close enough to vanilla for us.

Additional Thoughts: None at this time!
 
Other Plugins

1. Skipping for now.

2. I don’t agree with the addition of Shulker Boxes to Shroom With A View. The plugin was created with the intention to give players access to decorative blocks unobtainable in vanilla. If I cannot bonemeal an Observer or Piston to correctly align it, then I should not be able to do that to a Shulker Box either. I’m honestly a bit surprised padmins gave the OK for this to be added.

I also think the commands for ItemLocker are a bit unintuitive, and I have gotten feedback from a number of players corroborating that. Can the command syntax be updated to more closely mirror the container locks? (i.e. /imodify <rotate/access> <public/private/r:region>, and /imodify <public/private/r:region> for both rotate and access)

Additional Thoughts: None!
 
Closing Thoughts
 
Additional Thoughts: We have a very special community here and I am glad to be a part of it!
 

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20 hours ago, Barlimore said:

Map

Size

For revision 21, the map size is 9000 x 9000 blocks. We have been considering a smaller overworld map for revision 22, as confirmed in the discussion here.

  1. How have you found the current map size?
  2. We believe that returning to a smaller map size for next revision would encourage more community activity - something we are strongly looking to promote. What are your thoughts?

1. I do like this map, but it is very large and you have to go out of your way to find other users

2. Wholeheartedly agree.

Biomes

We used the Open Terrain Generator to generate the map and worldpainter to make smaller changes. This terrain generator allows for a variation in the types of biomes and allows us to modify them too before they generate, and worldpainter lets us make more precise changes on a smaller scale by comparison.

  1. How have you found the world generated?
  2. Which biomes would you like to see more of?
  3. Which biomes would you like to see less of?

1. I really like this world, plenty of variety!

2. I'd like to see more plains, but this map is so large there may be plenty of them I just haven't found them!

3. Swamps, personally.

 

 

 

 

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Expectations

1. Known revision duration is very beneficial.

2. Yes; when possible have notice of exact event times well in advance (at least a week), with reminder(s) as the event approaches.

3a. There is a good balance struck between garnering ideas from playerbase while retaining an editorial purview over what gets implemented. Speediness of implementation has been a major plus.

 

Map

 

Size

1. 9k x 9k is good with me.

2. The expected boost to community activity is based on people being closer together - I suggest compressing the player-attracting features (i.e. portals) into a tighter area and broadcasting this fact. Alternatively you can do what C does and do a mid-rev map expansion. Either way, you'll get more compact metropolitan areas for more collaboration/infrastructure while retaining the benefits of a wide map.

 

Biomes

1. Overall I'm a fan of the biome setup.

2. More dense jungle would be nice

3. No one biome stuck out as excessive.

Additional Thoughts: I would like to see a modest amount of the outrageous terrain a la revision 10's border - with surface terrain in sinkholes and massive cavernous spaces. More 3D terrain in general yields a more interesting and challenging experience. Also, I've noticed some areas where snow was generated at the beginning of the rev but only rain falls later (or the opposite) - this is a small thing that would be nice to fix.

 

Ore Distribution

1. No specific complaints or commendations with respect to ore distribution.

2. No.

3. Possibly iron.

4. Yes, I am a fan of biome-specific ore rarity - reducing ore probabilities in some biomes while raising them in others would also boost trade/travel/infrastructure investment around the map. This would be hard to balance well though, and if it were done I would want to see at least qualitative differences between biomes known before the beginning of the rev (some quest/puzzle in the previous rev would work).

 

Nether Portals

1. Layout was a fun change from the usual rotational symmetry

2. Similar portal density to this rev or previous revs would be fine.

 

Nether

1. I enjoyed the use of the extra vertical space, making for a much larger nether, and am particularly fond of the more diverse block palette. It would be nice if there were more connectivity between the upper and lower sections (sinkholes/caves/etc.)

2a. I prefer a player-made nether spawn, but there should be some procedure to decide who gets to build this unique structure rather than a straight land rush. Not sure what form that should take.

2b. I haven't used nether rails at all this rev, so I must abstain courteously.

 

End

1. Haven't visited the end much this rev - abstaining courteously once again.

2. The vanilla experience should still be available, but challenging boss fights are always a plus.

 

Mapworld

1. I like the idea, just wish that revision 19's mapworld had carried over too, heh.

2. People have also remarked that worldedit takes mapworld too far away from the PvE experience, but mapworld is remarkably non-vanilla in the first place - I see no issues with introducing it.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Spawn

1a. I expect to see a very simple layout, one where you can exit spawn swiftly and clearly, along one of four cardinal roads. I also expect to see mitigation of lag at spawn via the nether portal moved away from the spawn point.

2. I particularly enjoyed the Spanish Inquisition torture chambers, very authentic!

3. I enjoyed the integration of an overall theme this rev - spawn, portal names,

4. Pre-built rail station was a good return to a historical amenity - should prove even more useful with a more constrained map

 

Features

 

Iron Golem Spawners

1a. Abstaining courteously.

1b. Abstaining courteously.

1c. Abstaining courteously.

 

Custom Spawners

1. I prefer some custom spawners in the nether.

2. All.

3. None.

4. Okay if it's a necessity to fix spawn rate interference. Otherwise, the vanilla guardian mechanic is preferable.

 

Community

 

Blog Posts

1. Nothing in particular

2. Nothing in particular

 

Events

1. Fun

2. Would like to see more available sessions for limited events such as admin hunts.

3. None.

4a. Balanced items that aren't generally available. In particular, it's good to have stuff that was obtainable in previous events so that people get a second chance if they missed the first run.

 

Plugins

 

TrainCarts

1. Haven't interacted with it much, but have heard of issues for a number of people.

2. Abstaining courteously.

3. Only like the speed adjustment and trains - everything else is a bit over the top.

 

Other Plugins

1. Various incremental improvements have been nice in general.

2. Abstaining courteously.

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Expectations

  1. It´s always knowing the duration of the revisions it makes people be able to plan their time more accordingly and plan their builds likewise
  2. I would like information being revealed as we go like how the 6k was revealed rather than saying X events are gonna happen in this period, us having to work to get the events makes it seem more worth it
  3. The more surveys and collaboration with the player base the better

Map

Size

  • I honestly like the Map size, and dont feel like returning to a smaller map would encourage community activity, the thing I feel like would improve community activity and I don't want to see happening would be to limiting the number of portals to 1 at spawn, this way everything would be closer to spawn, and more roads and rails would be created but almost everyone would hate it.

 

Ore Distribution

  • Gold was a pain to collect for the horse, I end up with almost 4 times as much diamonds as I do gold when I mine.
  • Emeralds were far too abundant, and diamonds always seem like there are too many but that's also because we have no use for them after villagers 

Nether Portals

 

  1. The portals are in good locations but it seems like we have too many, there are a couple portals that are not developed in the slightest.

Nether

  1. Only the top nether should return, the vanilla nether is pretty boring but the top nether makes things fun. The problem with having 2 layers is inconvenient because at least for me I never know what portals are where and end up either being above or below them when travelling.
  2. We should have a nether spawn again mostly because the nether spawns that people build generally over sized, bland, boring and confusing.

End

  1. The end size is good because of ender towns the bigger it is the better the chance of more people raiding them for loots.

 

Mapworld

 

  1. The map world is a creative world where we get nothing out of, it should definitely have world edit, building maps takes time that could be used in making more productive things. 

 

Spawn

The only problem I have with spawn is events like the thanksgiving event trade in center that have no space pre set at the start so room gets made later on, a room specific for events of the same nature could fix this problem.


 

Features

Custom Spawners

Custom spawners if they aren't found in a certain amount of time let's say 2 months should have subtle hints being dropped, most people forget that there are portals that still haven't been found, those hints would remember people and make the search easier. I'm against the hot and cold thing because only people on at the time would get hints.

 

Community

Events

  1. I like events with upgradable rewards that keep reapering in future events (like it was done with excalibur), the only thing I dont like from events is when everything is too similar and ends up feeling like a drag

 

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Expectations

From the start of the revision, we set up our expectations of how the revision would play out, including for the first time ever, an estimated timeline for the revision duration.

  1. How are you finding this revision, knowing the revision duration in advance?
    • Same as the others, since I don't really base what I'm building on any end goal. I have a project to complete that I set for myself at the start of the rev, and build from there once I finish.  I do like knowing when the end is so that I don't start building something only to find out that I won't finish it due to the rev ending.
  2. We gave a rough outline for having more events in the latter half of the revision. Would you like more information along these lines in future?
    • Yes, it's good to know when things are happening.
  3. We made it clear that we wanted to involve you more in the decision making, and did just that with various events and tasks this revision. This involved the pve survey, a poll for the admin hunt location, the death message update and a number of suggestionbox submissions which were implemented

 

a. We want to continue down this path, and do more. How do you feel we did so far and what more can we look to do?

 I think the process was beneficial. I enjoy things more when I can contribute to how they happen in some way, and choosing locations and messages is a fun way to contribute in ways that just playing on the server doesn't allow.

 

Map

Size

For revision 21, the map size is 9000 x 9000 blocks. We have been considering a smaller overworld map for revision 22, as confirmed in the discussion here.

  1. How have you found the current map size?
    • I like the size, but a smaller map is better for reasons outlined below.
  2. We believe that returning to a smaller map size for next revision would encourage more community activity - something we are strongly looking to promote. What are your thoughts?
    • A large map, combined with elytra, is bad for the community. Before elytra, big maps were fun because they required the community to build roads/rails/etc to get around. Now, people get wings after a few days and cities become isolated. This rev has been *much* better for rails than the past few, mostly because the spawn station was pre-built. Last rev had no pre-built station, and no one built one, so rails suffered. If we do large maps in the future, we need to make elytra much harder to get. This map size feels nice since people, myself included, built rails, but there are few major roads for horse travel and I think a slightly smaller map would make roadbuilding more popular an endeavor.

 

Biomes

We used the Open Terrain Generator to generate the map and worldpainter to make smaller changes. This terrain generator allows for a variation in the types of biomes and allows us to modify them too before they generate, and worldpainter lets us make more precise changes on a smaller scale by comparison.

  1. How have you found the world generated?
    • Perfect. It's a great map in terms of biomes and their sizes. I love the mountains in the NE especially.
  2. Which biomes would you like to see more of?
    • Keep the mountain type used in the NE, and add in some more classic plains. 
  3. Which biomes would you like to see less of?
    • Ocean. The South is too watery. The North has a great river system that gives us lots of fun places to build, but the ocean feels too empty. If we do an ocean that big again, it should have some big islands to attract cities, like Pico this rev.

 

Ore Distribution

For the ore distribution this revision, we emulated the values of revision 19 (though there are notable differences). Additionally, compared to last revision, ores would typically generate where you’d expect to find them normally.

  1. How did you find the ore generation this revision?
    • Fine, much better than last rev. Diamonds and gold feel right again.
  2. Were there any ores you feel were too sparse?
    • I'd like more quartz in the overworld, but that's not too much of an issue.
  3. Were there any ores you feel were too abundant?
    • None, all seems fine.
  4. Would you like to see biomes specific ores such as the mesa being plumped for gold?
    • Yes. No preference as to which ores are plumped where, but biome-based plumping is a fun gameplay element since it can encourage exploring outside the standard biomes.

 

Nether Portals

For this map size, we spread 12 nether portal markers out around the map, with another nether portal at spawn. Each nether portal could be lit within 100 blocks of the marker, and placed in either the upper, or lower nether.

  1. We meticulously planned the bedrock markers to try to provide optimum coverage. How did you find the layout for this revision?
    • Good, I like the knights' names theme as well.
  2. Given that we are considering a smaller map size, how would you like to see the volume and layout of nether portals?
    • We only really need 8 portals unless the map is huge. I get why we had 12 this rev though, and having more didn't hurt gameplay.

 

Nether

This revision, we saw the nether divided into an upper nether, which was all entirely custom built by Sir_Didymus, and the lower nether being vanilla generation, with the bedrock roof mostly removed between the two.

  1. Would you like to see an upper nether return again, or shall we explore another format (such as an all-vanilla nether)?
    • All-vanilla nethers suck. They're boring, no fun to mine or build in, and they suck the fun out of hunting wither skeletons since the terrain is so wonky. I like having a custom-gen nether, particularly the ones we had a few revs ago with the glowstone trees and obsidian pillars. Those were fun, unique, and dangerous without being impossible to navigate.
  2. We introduced a nether spawn this revision, which was built by Barlimore, Sir_Didymus and with staff contributions. We did this to introduce people to the upper/lower nether concept.
    • I liked the rail stations at the bottom. I'd be fine with another staffmade spawn, perhaps of smaller size. 

a. Provided there is an upper nether again; Would you like a nether spawn to return in future, or would you like us to return to tradition and allow you to create your own nether spawn?

  • If the upper nether comes back, it'd be fun to see what players did with their own spawn. 

b. How did you find having a pre-built nether rail station?

  • Very useful. 

End

It’s the end! This world is typically generated completely vanilla. For this revision, the end was a size of 4500 x 4500.

  1. How do you feel about the size of the end? Should this be smaller?
    • No real preference, it's fine from what I can tell
  2. We have frequently heard feedback about wanting the end dragon fight made more difficult. How would you feel about the end dragon fight being a non-vanilla experience?
    • Make the dragon fight very difficult, and require it for a player to get elytra (if you don't make elytra prizes for a quest event.) The dragon is the final boss, and should require a team of players with max enchant gear to kill. Even then, it should be a really damn hard fight. Make the dragon respawnable, and somehow set the part of the end that players use to travel away from the dragon fight. A custom staff-built arena would be a great boss fight for anyone willing to take on the challenge. As for difficulty, imagine a wither that you can't put in a box, but twenty feet tall with three times the health and faster flight. In short, have a really challenging boss that gives really good prizes like wings. This will create an incentive to fight it, and lower the amount of wings on the server.

Mapworld

This revision, mapworld carried over from revision 20, allowing you to keep your plots, maps and modreq for them again without losing your work! We plan to bring mapworld over into revision 22 too.

  1. How have you found the experience of mapworld carrying over into the new revision?
    • N/A haven't used mapworld.
  2. Which changes would you like to see to mapworld, if any? Worldedit has been a frequent request and an example which we would love to hear feedback upon.
    • I'd rather have people building on the server than putting time in on mapworld to create things that only they and anyone living with them will likely see. Best to have worldedit, or at least a schematica printer, so people can make what they want without taking time away from sever builds. I'd use mapworld if I didn't have to waste hours putting a map together. 

 

Spawn

The overworld spawn this revision was curated by defiex, decorated by staff and built by jar9. We confirmed early this rev that the spawn building for revision 22 would be entirely built by nerd staff. With that in mind, we've made early progress on the spawn structure, to ensure a timely completion, and have made sure it fits well with the theme and events planned for revision 22.

  1. We have aimed for a very simple layout, one where you can exit spawn swiftly and clearly, along one of four cardinal roads. We are looking to further mitigate lag at spawn by moving the nether portal away from the spawn point.

a. What would you expect to see from the layout of spawn next revision?

  • Similar, I liked the simple layout.

        2. Which was your favourite Easter egg around spawn this revision?

  • I haven't been exploring enough to find any yet

        3. Are there any spawn ideas you’d like to submit for future?

  • I'd love to see a Greco-Roman spawn, lots of columns and a temple with a big statue of Zeus/Jupiter (or hell, the whole Parthenon

        4. How did you find having a pre-built spawn rail station?

  • Very useful. This feature needs to return. Could even integrate the station into spawn itself.


 

Features

Iron Golem Spawners

This revision, we replaced the wither skull cost from iron golem spawners and replaced it with a 1/500 chance of naturally generated iron ore of dropping a ‘golem soul’. We continued the practice of having these spawner costs lower each month, to make them more accessible to those outside of towns.

  1. More than 1000 golem souls have been mined in the revision so far, resulting in iron golem spawners bought swiftly and with spare golem souls going towards a community contribution for special villagers.

a. How would you like to see the iron golem spawner costs adjusted for the next revision?

  • Keep them like they are. I like the golem soul mechanic, and the amount of iron in circulation stimulates rail building.

b. Would you like us to return to the practice of having people unlock a golem spawner, then upgrade them for an additional cost?

  • Yes, keeps mining going. Also meshes with the vanilla mechanic of having to build another farm to get more iron.

c. Do you have any further suggestions on how you’d like to see golem souls used?

  • It'd be fun to have the option to donate them again, I like that.

Custom Spawners

For this revision, we revealed the custom spawners hidden around the world as bedrock markers, and whether those spawners were in the overworld of nether. This was documented in the public document here.

  1. Following a suggestion-box suggestion, we would like to ask whether you would prefer for all custom spawners to be located in the overworld, rather than shared with the nether?
  • I'd rather have them all in the overworld. Having a spawner in the nether invites AFK, which reduces the spawnrate for wither skeletons.
  1. Which custom spawners would you like to see in revision 22?
  • Same as we have, minus the nether spawners.
  1. Which custom spawners would you no longer wish to see in revision 22?
  • I don't think we need nether spawners.
  1. Guardian grinders became an issue this revision with their spawning rates conflicting with each other and other grinders. If possible, would you like to see a number of guardian spawners introduced to replace generated guardian spawning areas?
  • I'm not familiar with the issue, I won't chime in.

 

Community

Blog Posts

This revision, we continued publishing blog posts throughout the revision. So far we have published two of a total four, where the final blog post will go out at the end of the revision as a wrap-up.

  1. Is there anything in the blog post you’d like to see more of?
  • I like the infographics, and the first blog post is fun since it shows off all the cities. I think the last blog of each revision should show the cities again, with an eye on showing off progress since the first post.
  1. Is there anything in the blog post that you’d like to see less of?
  • Nothing really, I like what's being done

Events

We have continued to introduce a number of small and large events this revision, with the aim to have more available in the second half of the revision to give you more reasons to log back in and return.

  1. How have you found the events so far?
    • Great! The Knight's Quests were probably the most fun (and frustration, but it's a game, if it's not hard it's not fun) I've had on the server in a long time. That kind of event, or something like it, needs to make a comeback next rev.
  2. Which events would you like to see more of?
    • More quests! More seek-and-find, more big, map-spanning puzzles and adventures that make you explore. 
  3. Which events would you like to see less of?
    • It's all fun, keep it all
  4. Balancing prizes is something we always take as much care as possible with, depending on the nature of the event and how far through the revision we are.

a. Those two important points aside though, which prizes would you like to see introduced in future events?

  • This is part of some thoughts on elytra I'll expand on below, but I think that elytra need to be made much harder to obtain. Make them prizes for a particularly hard quest or event, so people have an incentive to actually explore the server instead of jetting around to where they need to go and not actually seeing what the community has to offer.

Plugins

TrainCarts

This revision saw the introduction of the plugin TrainCarts. We included this plugin based on your feedback last revision. We implemented this plugin in a heavily restricted version (so none of this), keeping it reasonably close to HyperCarts, which we were using previously. We appreciate that this was a new plugin, with some hiccups throughout, so thank you for reporting issues to us as they came up.

  1. How have you found the TrainCarts plugin?
    • Useful, I like the added functionality but I don't use much of it.
  2. Would you like us to continue using this plugin?
    • I like anything that makes rails easier to build and use.
  3. Are there any other features of TrainCarts that you would like us to explore using?
    • Not really, what we have seems to work.

Other Plugins

Revision 21 also saw the implementation of changes to existing plugins, such as the /place overhaul that pez252 brought us, which was introduced from the back of a suggestionbox suggestion.

  1. Which changes to existing plugins have you found welcome?
    • N/A at this time
  2. Which changes to existing plugins would you like to see further changes to, or even removal of?
    • N/A, things seem fine

 

Closing Thoughts

We are now passing the halfway point in the revision and look forward to seeing you on P with whichever projects you’re working on.

Thank you ever so much for being a fantastic community!

I've really enjoyed this rev, more than the last one. Last rev, at least to me, felt like a let down because a lot of what I really enjoyed about PvE was encroached upon by the presence of elytra. These wings kill communities. They kill the incentive structure that made earlier revisions a real community effort. Before wings, we built great, map-spanning rail systems. Remember CARBON? That was the greatest collaborative engineering project I've ever seen. Roads were big too, and every major city had a land route to every other. Even when wings were first introduced, they weren't too much of a cancer on the server. They were glide-only. Yes, bowflight was a thing, but for the most part people glided off of flight towers and mountains. This meant that one still had to plan a route to get somewhere. If I wanted to go from Rev17 Raven Rock to somewhere down south, I had to glide to Rose, take the rails up their spiral tower, and fly from there. Bowflight was an option, but it wasn't reliable compared to the firework propulsion we have now, and it had a detrimental effect on health. When elytra flight became powered, the wings destroyed any need to  build roads or rails. In Rev20, the only reason we even had a major road system was the Continental Route that Zarton_ built on his own. Without their hard work, horses would have been basically useless for long-distance travel. Rev20 rails were dead.  No big spawn station. One or two towns with more than one connection. WIngs were and are too easy to get. This rev, rails have come back because the admins created a station. It's been a success, and one can traverse the whole map without wings. I don't think wings need to be removed altogether, but they need to be much harder to get. Essence of flight should be a drop that comes from flying mobs alone particularly ones that don't come from a special spawner. Only the ender dragon should give you a realistic chance of getting an EoF on the first try, and, as I mentioned above, the ender dragon fight needs to be a really difficult boss battle that takes way more prep than it does now. The dragon dies within the first 24 hours of the server being up, without fail every revision. It'd be much more interesting if the dragon could only realistically be killed with max-enchant armor and weapons. It should be a fight that players will fail at unless they either get really good at it, or show up with enough friends to kill it. If this isn't implemented, then we need to seriously consider reverting elytra to unpowered flight only. Gliding between cities is a balanced mechanic. It encourages map knowledge, infrastructure building in the form of flight towers, and makes exploration more fun and feasible than simply jetting off to y500 and not seeing the ground until you dive into your destination. Either way, we need to significantly reduce how powerful elytra are.

 

Edit: 2 posts from the subreddit regarding elytra balancing that I think deserve further attention:

 

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Expectations

1. Initially agains't this sort of thing, but now unsure. I hasn't seemed to effect player numbers as we originally feared, but time will tell.

2. Hopefully events such as these will keep that retention going ^. Personally I usually miss timed events due to my life schedule (unless they are week+ long things like Valentines),

so this topic doesn't really effect me.

3a. Not all player idea are good ideas. Choosing event locations and the like are fine, but having a death message "AHHHHHHH"

is really not (what even is this? Death reasons should at least be able to be guessed.). I know you guys already pick and choose, but maybe be more picky?

Additional Thoughts:

 

Map

 

Size

1. I still think this map is too big. Running from spawn to the corner I reside in; I found maybe 2 or 3 settlements on the way. It made the map feel really dead to me.

2. As above, yes.

Additional Thoughts: I agree with Randoms, and Fawkes thought on the whole elytra thing; it's a serious issue for a map of any size. I'll clarify my thoughts more below

 

Biomes

1. It feels like there's less biome variety this rev, but maybe that's just coincidental.

2. Something more unique. Too much of the map feels "vanilla" to me.

3. Less open flat plains

Additional Thoughts: Could we get some underground generated structures up in here? Every single above ground one is pillaged instantly.

 

Ore Distribution

1. I voiced my thoughts in a reddit thread a couple months ago.

2. Too sparse... if anything, maybe lapis?

3. Too much diamond.

4. Biome specific ore, yes! Nerf everything across the board and buff specific ores in specific biomes

(For example, cut all ores in half on the map, and double lapis in the ocean, gold in mesa, etc.)

Additional Thoughts:

 

Nether Portals

1. No opinion

2. No opinion

Additional Thoughts:

 

Nether

1. The upper nether, while... cool? looking, its completely 100% barren and the biomes are way too huge.

I didn't even know there was a vanilla nether below and was running around for 20 minutes looking for a blaze.

2a. Let the players do spawn

2b. I don't use rails

Additional Thoughts:

 

End

1. No opinion

2. Please make the fight A LOT more difficult. The fact that one player can do it in a couple days solo is just pure silliness, for an end-game boss. Since MC's nature AI is shit, there's not a whole lot you can do to improve the vanilla difficulty... maybe find an alternative?

Additional Thoughts:

 

Mapworld

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Spawn

1a.

2.

3.

4.

Additional Thoughts: You know my thoughts.

 

Features

 

Iron Golem Spawners

1a.

1b.

1c.

Additional Thoughts: Maybe make some more "soul type drops" from the other ore types, they can be as rare or rarer... but don't ask me what they'd be used for.

 

Custom Spawners

1.

2.

3.

4.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Community

 

Blog Posts

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Events

1.

2.

3.

4a.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Plugins

 

TrainCarts

1.

2.

3.

Additional Thoughts: Dumb plugin, extremely unnecessary.

 

Other Plugins

1.

2.

Additional Thoughts:

 

Closing Thoughts

 

Additional Thoughts: Make elytra extremely rare, like they should be. Nerf the droprate from the easily soloable dragon to a 5%(?) chance for a head or an eof.

Remove eof drops from all mobs except the dragon. I have gotten 4 eof's from dicking around while mining...

                                       Secondly, find a way to remove powered flight. You cannot deny that it is extremely overpowered and hurts the development of the server. It should have never been added to vanilla.

Edit: Just incase I wasn't clear, I support making the Ender Dragon fight actually difficult AND nerfing the EoF & Dragon Head drop rate to a very low chance(around 5%) for either, AND removing EoF drops from all other mobs AND removing powered flight entirely from the server. Yes all 4 of them at once.

Edited by Trooprm32
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(note that I’ve been absent from the map for about a month, and I've removed questions that I did not provide an answer to) 

Expectations

  1. I do kind of like it.  The rev length is far in the future that knowing the rev ends in six months is not as dissuading as I had thought, and it does give a better sense of time in terms of when to expect the end of the map.  (As a former Padmin, this was the kind of thing I had worried about as something that would discourage players from logging in, but I’m happy to see the fear appears so far to be overly exaggerated.)

 

Map

Size

  1. Living close to a portal evidently makes the 9kx9k map feel small.  There isn’t a place I couldn’t reach by using the portal network, perhaps taking rails, and then flying the rest of the way.  My viewpoint here is probably going to be biased.

  2. It would be interesting to see the effect of a smaller map size - I do not have a strong preference either way (my building footprint isn’t large enough that I expand into contact with others often), but certainly the distance to bridge by rail would decrease if settlements and points of interest were all closer together.

 

Nether

  1. I enjoyed the dichotomy that the two-layer Nether presented, though I am not sure if I spent a lot of time in both: most of the time if I’m not on the rails, I’ve been in the upper Nether more than the lower.

2b. I like the Nether spawn rail station.  As a portal maintainer, it is a much closer target to lay rail to; as a traveler it really helps to have the station there (though mostly because it is effectively a rail hub now, which makes portal-to-portal travel more or less straightforward).

 

End

2.  Could a harder fight be added as an additional possibility rather than an overwrite of the existing End dragon fight?  Though a non-vanilla dragon fight sounds like fun, I am not sure the need for it in place of the vanilla fight is great, given that I feel some players still regard the vanilla dragon as too difficult to fight.

 

Mapworld

  1. It is useful to me to have mapworld plots retained.  Building new mapworld plots felt a bit time-consuming to do, so having plots whose images I want to reuse this rev (or didn’t realize I wanted to until later) are already complete has been really helpful.

  2. WorldEdit to me is most useful for quickly changing the background color of a plot.  For simpler map art, I think that ability would be useful.  (It would naturally be less useful for very detailed pixel art, where use of WorldEdit would probably not be so advantageous.)

 

Spawn

1a. I am moderately surprised that the portal is the source of lag, but if the goal is to move it away, I would also suggest bringing the rail station with it: a highly convenient arrangement in the past was having the spawn portal and rail station next to each other.  

4. The distance between my camp and the spawn rail station was prohibitive enough that I didn’t consider laying rail to it (part of this is because I live near a portal and it feels like a faster route to spawn).  That being said, in the absence of portals or to avoid traveling out of my way to reach one, it is convenient, though sometimes I forget it is there because it is located east of spawn (could it be moved into the spawn build itself?).  Otherwise, I’m impressed with how many connections the station is able to accommodate as well as that it presents a solution to the issues we (again as an ex-Padmin) had of having a rail station at spawn.

 

Features

 

Iron Golem Spawners

1a. Maybe this is just me and being a lazy miner, but as an individual, it felt like an unreasonable time sink to obtain enough golem souls for a grinder (I believe my stats were 1 golem soul from 400 iron mined so far - too few for a spawner, let alone a surplus to use elsewhere).  The obvious remedy of course is to keep mining, but given the rarity of golem souls, I projected that I would be spending too much time mining for iron for golem souls for a grinder - it feels like too much of a grind that the ability to make a grinder for myself is effectively out of my reach.  (I respect the idea that it should take significant effort to set up a grinder, not everyone who wants a grinder should be able to get one, etc., but it feels a bit disconcerting to come up against a steep wall like this compared to last rev.)  Otherwise, the possibility of a soul dropping does make mining for iron more fun and less mundane than previously.

 

Additional Thoughts: One thing that I find odd is that, while there is a push for more rails to be laid and used as an alternative to elytra, there is simultaneously a push to make (AFK) iron harder to obtain.  I don’t think the two goals mix very well: if iron takes too much effort to obtain in quantities needed for a well-connected rail network, I would think that would translate into less rail laid; if rail laying is encouraged, it makes sense that iron for rails should be made readily available.  The (admittedly somewhat elegant) solution this rev seems to be alts sitting at iron grinders, which I am grateful for (along with Djentle gifting a lot of iron for my own rail laying) - but in their absence, I am hard-pressed to see how both goals could be achieved at the same time, barring the presence of players who enjoy devoting their time completely to mining or laying rails.  

 

Custom Spawners

4. I’m not in favor, mostly because I am moderately wary about the turn this will take (similar to how iron golems have been treated since they were made spawner-only mobs), though I haven’t thought about this too deeply myself.  Spawners would make spawning deterministic, which would indeed solve the issue of grinder outputs being at the mercy of mob distribution around the map.  But I’m more worried about whether the mechanics brought in to replace it will in fact truly approximate vanilla difficulty.  On top of that, I’m not entirely impressed with the rationale with which these concerns have arisen.

 

Plugins

 

TrainCarts

  1. It is a great plugin - not only in terms of the speed boost (and one that seems robust to a high frequency of twists and turns and dips), but railing with other players as a train makes group travel more entertaining.  My experience has been a little rough around the edges - there was one arrangement of carts where I felt like I was going too slowly (maybe chest cart attached to empty cart on powered rails? I think when I added a furnace cart, the train sped up to the usual high speed), and I’ve noticed some of my rails changing orientation sometimes unintentionally, but it has been a good plugin otherwise.

  2. Yes.

 

Edited by buzzie71
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Hi @WickedCoolSteve

Thanks for providing such detailed feedback - it really helps us plan for the upcoming rev. I’m glad you feel we are doing a decent job of balancing community involvement with admin decision-making - we really try to ensure that feedback is heard, and applied sensibly given the constraints we must work within. We hope to continue reaching out to the community, to ensure that the direction in which we take the server is one that is supported by our players.

You say you are in favour of larger map sizes. Having played both small and very large maps, I find myself supporting a reduction in size - the things I miss from smaller maps are mainly just the people stopping by on their way to something else, or just exploring because they happened to be travelling past. As map sizes increase, I find these accidental meetings to be fewer and further between, and I think that sort of minor encounter plays a role in forming a cohesive community. Having said that, I see your point about increased conflict and fewer resources, and would be happy to settle for something of a middle-sized map, where we can have the best of both worlds.

I’m glad you’ve enjoyed the custom generated terrain this rev - it was a new generator this time, and I feel it has really helped to gel biomes together more seamlessly. Ore generation is always a hard thing to get right, so we’ll be looking through this topic to try to get a general consensus on what was considered rare or over abundant. If they prove popular across this feedback topic, we’ll definitely be looking into biome specific ores (assuming they are possible within our current set-up).

Having designed the upper nether this rev, I’m interested in your feedback regarding the difficulty in navigating the nether. Occasionally I have noticed people raising issues about portals being on a different level to the one they travelled on - is this something you found to be a problem? You say you would prefer a single layer nether - is there any custom terrain you’d particularly like to see return, or anything you have in mind that would be fun/useful in the nether? Or would you prefer to see a vanilla nether next rev?

We’ve experimented with custom End terrain, but so far haven’t conclusively worked out all the kinks, such as whether the dragon always spawns correctly, or whether End Cities generate correctly in custom terrain. More investigations are needed, but there is definitely always experimentation going on - and this sort of thing may be something we develop more fully in future.

Your comments on spawn mirror closely our ideals for spawn areas. We think it should be straightforward to get out there into the map and get on with mining and crafting! We’ve definitely spent some time on the design of the next spawn to try to improve directional flow and general ease of use. A spawn rail station is something that had been frequently requested in previous revs, in order to support rail building from day one of the new rev. Horses and elytra both changed the landscape in terms of transportational infrastructure, and we’re keen to hear any opinions on the inclusion of a spawn rail station and how it has affected builders this rev. Perhaps next rev will see a major road revival or even a resurgence of the Roadbuilders’ Association!

We’re glad you’re enjoying mining up Golem Souls - they were a new mechanic we were trying out for this rev. And we agree that there are lots of options for this sort of thing, and will certainly consider that when planning next revision. Do you have any ideas in mind for the sorts of things you’d like to use these sorts of special ‘block drops’ for?

It’s great to know you’ve been enjoying the events so far this revision. You say you’d like to see more non-combat events - do you mean not fighting players, or not fighting anything at all? Do you have any particular events in mind that you’d really like to see? Do you prefer one-off events or those that you can complete in your own time?

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Hi @ieuweh

Thank you very much for your kind words. It’s helpful for us to know that from your experience, we’re on the right track in regards to the expectations section of the feedback. Being able to hear about your experiences, as someone who is participating in their first full revision, is really great – it gives us a viewpoint we don’t always get to see, and perhaps some fresh new ideas!

A number of people have mentioned that their experience is that gold has been more difficult to find than some other ores; it seems to be in short supply for those looking to feed their horses or lay down rails. Which types of biomes and ores would you like to see altered for the next revision?

I’m glad you enjoyed the custom nether this revision. Are there any particular biomes or areas that you’d like to see make a comeback in a future revision? In Revision 22, would you like to see a part-custom nether make a return, a fully customised (one level) nether, or simply a return to a vanilla nether map?

It sounds like you had some fun with the enderdragon! It takes some people numerous revisions to decide to approach that daunting endeavour. We’ll definitely be looking into what we can do to make the enderdragon fight more replayable, although we’re in the early days of research right now. Hopefully we’ll work out something fun for everyone!

It’s seems like you have taken over the mapworld with your pixel art paintings! It’s wonderful to see it being used so successfully throughout the revision, and your maps will stay into Revision 22 so that we can all enjoy them again! You’ve got some excellent ideas there for ways we can use custom map art as part of our server events, and we’d definitely be happy to include maps as prizes or puzzle pieces etc. Lots to think about for next revision!

That’s an interesting take you have on nether spawners - sometimes as long-term players we forget that the nether is terrifying(!) and that some people are nervous about exploring it. It’s also an excellent way of encouraging people to find more of our customised nether areas and there has definitely been an increase in the number of people exploring the nether in detail this revision.

Thank you for your nice comments about the blog post - it takes a significant amount of time to put them together, but it’s worth it in the end to be able to share some of the builds and experiences of players during the revision. We aim to keep these up in Revision 22, as we agree with you that they can be an excellent way for newer players to get to know more about the server.

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Hi @nealsmith

Thanks for your comments! It’s great to know you’ve been enjoying the rev so far, and always nice to hear positive comments.

You say you’ve enjoyed the ore distributions and caves etc. this rev. Out of interest, do you support biome specific ores, or would you prefer to keep things exactly as they are?

Have you any events you’d particularly like to see? Do you prefer PvP, PvE or non-combat type events? Do you participate in one-off events, or do you prefer those that you can do over a revision at your own pace?

11/10? That's quite the score! :laugh:

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Hi @Silversunset01 (The Unruly, Queen of the Havenites, Traverser of the Great Southern Sea, Breaker of Jars and Creator of Assorted Shelving)

Thanks for your feedback. Good to know we’re on the right track! We’d agree with your assessment on biomes - there could definitely be more concrete making resources. We tried to mitigate this somewhat with the nether design, which has numerous sand-filled areas, and even a bit of gravel here and there!

You’re echoing a few people’s thoughts here that diamonds were slightly over-plumped this rev. Do you think the current levels of diamond have negatively affected the current revision? It sounds like you support some biome-specific ore - would you say you’d prefer to closely mimic vanilla in this respect, or would you like to see other ores distributed similarly?

Your thoughts on portals echo many discussions had between PAdmin teams past and present. On the one hand, it would be nice to offer portals more freely to players. On the other hand we have to ensure our decisions don’t have negative effects on infrastructure, and are fair to all players. We’ll certainly be considering portals carefully in our discussions for the next revision.

I see you weren’t a fan of the two-level nature of the nether this revision. That aside, are there any areas of the present nether that you’d like to see return in Revision 22? Is there anything you’d like to see added that wasn’t a feature of the nether this time around?

Our question regarding guardian spawners is specific to the issues we had generating the map this time around. We are looking at all possible options should problems occur again. Unless other avenues prove too problematic, it’s unlikely we’d look to implement spawners over using vanilla mechanics in this instance.

It’s unfortunate you’ve not been able to use TrainCarts to its full potential. Some people do seem to have a few issues with it, whereas others experience very few problems. We’ll take onboard all the feedback in this thread and try to balance up all the positives and negatives provided by players before making decisions on plugins for Revision 22.

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Hi @bermudalocket

Thanks for your feedback - it really helps us in discussions about our direction for next revision. I’m glad you feel we’ve been improving the area of community involvement - it’s been a major focus for us to improve the general output from the PAdmin team, in terms of reliable responses and regular updates, as well as getting the community involved in various aspects of PvE. Does anything in particular come to mind that made you take notice of the improvements taking place?

We agree that ocean monuments have been a bit too abundant this revision - this was a result of problems with the map generator, and in fact we spent a great deal of time prior to launching the map, trying to get rid of even more excessive amounts of ocean monuments that had spawned. We’re hoping to avoid that issue in the next revision, if possible. We’re glad you have made the best of it with your guardian grinder.

Biomes come along with the map generator to some extent, and from memory there are upwards of 400 biomes with varying similarities to each other, so some repetition is to be expected. However, we are looking at what sorts of things we could do to further customise our experience, should we choose to use the same generator for next revision. We have made a note of your love of birch forests, and will ensure that 99% of the map is birch next revision.

Sorry to hear the upper nether caused issues for you in terms of mob-spawning. The main goal was to create an additional area for players to explore, that was a little different to the typical nether experience. I’ve been interested to see how players have used it this revision, which was very much an experiment. Would you prefer to see a single layer vanilla or custom nether next revision? If custom, what sorts of materials or biomes would you like to see there?

Regenerating the outer end islands is an interesting proposition - do you have any experiences with something similar on other servers? I’m wondering if it’s technically possible without downtime or performance issues. Another thought is that newer players would be at a disadvantage, since people who already have elytra would probably find it much easier to explore the End quickly.

WorldEdit is an often requested feature for Mapworld, and I’d be interested to hear from anyone else who supports it’s inclusion. Personally I think of Mapworld as a growing set of decorative resources for all players to use, and I’m glad we have now implemented saving maps across revs. I’d like to see this idea developed further in future, especially now that Mapworld is increasing in popular usage.

Regarding golem spawners, is there any particular reason you’d like to see us return to using Emerald Ore? And what is your reasoning for preferring upgradeable spawners? If they were upgradeable, do you think there should be a limit on the level you can upgrade them to? I’d like to get a better sense of your reasoning for your answers here.

Thanks for your comments around events - we’ve tried hard to offer a varied menu so far this rev, with more yet to come! If you have any specific events that you’d like to see on P, whether they be one-off or more continuous in nature, we’d love to hear them. 

We’ve had mixed feedback for TrainCarts - some people are really enjoying the additional functionality, and others would prefer to go back to previous incarnations of rail. It’s been an interesting plugin to try out, especially with some of the functionality, like the linking of carts to make trains, and we’ve certainly seen an increase in rail building this rev. Out of interest, would you prefer to keep TrainCarts, or go back to either HyperCarts (as it was) or vanilla?

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Hi @KingNyahman

Thank you for your feedback - it’s great to hear from a wide range of players as to how you are finding the servers. You say you’d prefer a smaller map size - do you see benefits for yourself, in having a reduced map size? We’re interested in individual player experiences - I’d love to know how a large map has affected your gameplay this revision, and how you think things might change with a smaller map.

We’re glad you like the present map! We used a newer map generator this revision, and have been quite pleased with the map it produced. Plains are nice areas for building large cities and other big plans, so I can see why you’d like to see more of them. Are there a lot of swamps in the area you settled this revision, or do you feel there are too many swamps across the whole map? Do you have any biome ideas of your own that you wish existed in minecraft?

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Hi @schererererer

Thanks for the feedback! It’s great to get differing viewpoints from around the server. Your thoughts on the map are interesting - more wild terrain is something I’d love to see too. You might be the first person I’ve ever seen request more dense jungle! The snow problem is a strange one we noted earlier in the rev - we’ll certainly look into whether there are fixes for that, if we choose to generate the map in a similar fashion for next rev.

In regards to the nether, were there any areas/biomes in particular that you would like to see again? Or anything from previous revs you’d like to bring back?

It’s always difficult to find a schedule for events that ensures everyone can participate. We’ve tried to ensure that there have been events that people can participate in at any time, as well as the one-off events that happen from time to time. Do you have ideas for events that you’d like to see on the server?

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Hi @dobreira

Your feedback is appreciated! It’s great to know that you’re enjoying giving input here, in previous surveys and via suggestion box. Hopefully we can continue this trend in future.

In terms of the map, what sort of things do you think we could do to promote community activity? You’ve given the option of having only one portal at spawn, but you don’t seem to believe that would be a viable option - are there any things you think would work and be acceptable to players? Ore distribution seems to have been slightly off for you. Would you support biome specific ores or ore-plumping as a means to encourage people to explore the map?

It sounds like you enjoyed the custom nether this rev, but not the two level nature of the nether world. Are there any particular things you enjoyed about this rev’s custom nether, or anything you’d like to see again from a previous revision?

Your comments about having a specific area for temporary events at spawn make sense and we’ll certainly take that into consideration when planning features for next spawn build. Can you think of any other essential features at spawn that have been missing historically?

Your suggestion for unfound custom spawners is already happening! One of the leftover spawners has been found already. We’ll look to continue this in the next revision if need be.

You say you don’t like events where ‘everything is too similar’. Do you have examples of the sorts of things you are referencing? It’s handy to know where we can endeavour to improve the events we run in future.

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@Sir_Didymus  - King of the Tater Thieving Farmers of the Northern Quarter. 

In response to your kind inquiry:

Quote

We tried to mitigate this somewhat with the nether design, which has numerous sand-filled areas, and even a bit of gravel here and there!

Whoever wants to decimate that lovely nether should be strung up by their netherregions!

 

Quote

Do you think the current levels of diamond have negatively affected the current revision? It sounds like you support some biome-specific ore - would you say you’d prefer to closely mimic vanilla in this respect, or would you like to see other ores distributed similarly?

I think having full gear very fast leads to people being "done" faster. That being said it depends on the users end-game. I think having a custom spread across biomes would be a great deviation from vanilla that would make things more interesting for certain.

 

Quote

I see you weren’t a fan of the two-level nature of the nether this revision. That aside, are there any areas of the present nether that you’d like to see return in Revision 22? Is there anything you’d like to see added that wasn’t a feature of the nether this time around?

I don't tend to stay long in the nether, since i know it hurts hunters because of the way spawning works. To me its either a place to hunt or a "point a to point b" method of travel and that's it. Unless the spawning bit isn't so severe i don't know that anything would change my opinion of it, regardless of how lovely it is. 

 

Quote

It’s unfortunate you’ve not been able to use TrainCarts to its full potential. Some people do seem to have a few issues with it, whereas others experience very few problems. 

Sadly i have nothing *but* problems. Unless they're fixed i don't think i'll be using rails at all. Its not worth dying just to get somewhere.

 

Love, 

Queen Sunset, Master of all Shelving and Shelving Accessories!

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Hi @Herr_Fawkes

Thanks for responding to our feedback topic, it’s much appreciated! I’m glad to know that you’re enjoying our attempts to increase interaction with the community and helping to shape our server. I particularly enjoyed seeing all the death messages people came up with - it has resulted in a wide variety of them making it onto the server, increasing our originality and making us unique. Are there any areas you have enjoyed contributing towards in particular, or anything you’d like to see happen in future?

I see you support moving to a smaller map, and feel strongly about how elytra has contributed to a lack of infrastructure. Are there any ways in which you feel elytra has been beneficial to the community, or do you think we’d be better without them entirely? I know that a lot of players love to use them, and we’re always on the lookout for ways that we can integrate them more successfully into a well-rounded infrastructure. One of the ways we tried this rev was re-introducing the spawn rail station, which seems to have had some success in re-invigorating the rail systems across the map. Do you think that the pre-built spawn rail station should continue into the next revision?

I’m glad to know you’ve been enjoying the custom parts of the nether this revision (and previously). Do you have any biomes you’d like to see return from this revision? Do you like the two level nature of the nether, or would you prefer to see a fully customised one?

It’s interesting to hear your thoughts on the dragon fight - a lot of people seem to want something more difficult than what we have at present. Your ideas about including other custom mobs sound fun, though I’m not sure it’s if it’s possible to create giant mobs in most cases. It would be nice to see custom mobs used somewhere though, as they have been requested before.

The golem souls seem to have been generally well received, as a mechanic for building iron grinders, and in general. I’d be interested to know if you have any ideas for their use beyond iron grinder costs for next rev, if we decide to bring them back.

It’s great that you have been enjoying the Knight’s Quest - we’re headed towards 40 completions so far this rev, so it’s proved quite popular. We love making the rev long puzzles and quests, and will definitely look to include similar things in future revs. Do you have anything you’d like to see make a comeback in terms of events, or any new ideas?

Thanks for linking the elytra discussions - we were interested to read people’s viewpoints at the time, and the feedback is useful now as we plan the next revision.

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Hi @Trooprm32

Thanks for taking the time to offer feedback here - I hope you are enjoying the revision so far! In terms of the map, we’ve noted from the map sizes topic that you’d lean more towards a 6k x 6k map. You mention elytra, which is a big concern for a number of players. Do you have any ideas on how you would like to see elytra dealt with in future revisions? Elytra is certainly something we’ll need to think about for the future, and we have spent a lot of time reading through comments and listening to opinions on this topic. Hopefully we’ll come up with a healthy balance for next revision.

It’s interesting that you’re finding the map too vanilla. Do you your interests lean more towards outlandish or extreme terrain? I’ve found some great vistas this revision, but not everyone has had similar experiences it seems. We’ve had both requests for more plains and requests for less! There are custom underground dungeon areas, but we’d be interested in exploring whether or not the generator supports additional structure types. Something to look into, although we’re all still very much learning about how to generate or create a decent map. Hopefully, you will see improvements revision to revision. A lot of people seem to be supporting the concept of biome specific ore distributions, so that’s something we’ll definitely be discussing when we start our map preparation.

The nether this revision was very much an experiment in the use of WorldPainter. The map generator we use for the overworld doesn’t support the generation of custom nether yet, as far as I know. However, with WorldPainter, I learned a lot on the job last revision, so if we go with a custom nether again, who knows what we might end up with in Revision 22!

There’s been a lot of support for investigating ways in which we can improve the dragon fight in the End. We’ll definitely be looking into what is possible in this area, though there are no fixed plans to implement anything at the present time. We need to consider both regular and experienced players, and ensure the fight is challenging, but remains fun.

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Hi @buzzie71

Thanks for your feedback, buzzie! I too am interested to see what effects we might see from returning to a smaller map. I think it would be worth trying out for a revision, to see how people feel about it. I hope that it might encourage more people to do simple things, like visit their neighbour, or attend a nearby event.

I’m glad to hear that you enjoyed the concept of the nether. Some people have mentioned that they found it confusing - did you have any difficulty in that area? Would you like to see a custom nether next revision, a return to vanilla, or somewhere inbetween? Were there any areas of this revision’s nether that you particularly enjoyed or would like to see again?

In relation to the dragon fight - we’re still very early into preparation and haven’t yet looked in detail at what we might do to mitigate some people’s concerns, either about the fight being too easy, or about the abundance of elytra and its perceived effect on infrastructure and exploration. Hopefully we’ll be able to balance opinions and come up with something to try out, at the very least.

I’m a supporter of keeping map art across revisions, and interested in what people think about implementing WorldEdit in the mapworld. I think it can only help the server, by allowing people interested in creating map art to more quickly produce their amazing pieces, for the whole server to enjoy.

I think the spawn station has been useful in encouraging players to build rails both to spawn and to one another, and in that respect it did its job - to increase the take up of rail building across the server. Would you like to see the pre-built rail station make an appearance again next revision?

TrainCarts has been both liked and disliked this revision it seems,for various reasons. Carting around with your friends in a train is fun, but the glitchy issues experienced by some other users is cause for concern too. We’ll need to weigh up the pros and cons in this case.

You mention you found golem souls a bit of a grind - do you have any thoughts on how you’d like to see iron grinders implemented next revision, or on how golem souls (or their mechanic) could be used in future? Would you like to see similar drops from other ore types, with some attached use or saleability?

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@Sir_Didymus

I think elytra have benefits in allowing people to move quickly and spend more time building, mining, and other things that can get delayed because taking rails/roads is a less efficient means of movement. Wings also let people visit settlements that aren't easily accessible via rails or roads. I don't think we need to get rid of wings entirely, because they can and have coexisted with rails and other transportation modes. We didn't really see a huge decline in  rail infrastructure until rev19, despite introducing wings halfway through rev17. If my research is correct, rocket-powered flight was introduced in 1.11.1 in late 2016, just in time for rev19 in early 2017. I don't think we had powered flight for a full rev until rev20, and the rail and road infrastructure took a massive dive. However, rev18 had both wings and a vibrant rail system. Lite Rail was the ultimate evolution of CARBON, and it worked well. Rev21 has seen rails make a comeback thanks to the prebuilt spawn station, which I think ought to be continued. Having a ready-made, reliable place to start rails has been a boon for transport. Rails and wings can coexist, but not if powered flight is allowed. Besides, the admins saw powered flight as "too overpowered" when they discussed it in this old blog post:

Getting rid of wings isn't possible. We have to keep the server palatable for new players, and that means allowing them to get wings in some form. Besides, they're fun to use, and are useful for transport. I don't want to see them go. There are two routes I see the future taking in terms of liming wings.

First, we could preserve the powered flight system, making the server more attractive to new players who are used to 1.12 flight mechanics. The issue with powered flight as it stands is that there's no counterbalance for it. Mending means that wings can be fixed as many times as a player needs/wants to go to an XP grinder. Using fireworks to fly only depletes your supply of the things. Creeper spawners make replenishing fireworks easy. When bowflight was the only powered flight option, one ran the risk of dying if they used too many arrows. Fireworks have turned flight into a risk-free endeavor. In vanilla, one has to kill creepers in the wild for their gunpowder. That's risky, and makes players work for . Thus, the easiest way to nerf flight is to remove creeper spawners and make players gather resources the old-fashioned way. This returns us to a more vanilla-like game in terms of spawners. Powered flight in itself isn't the issue. In a vanilla game, it takes 1 gunpowder to make a low-powered rocket. Killing a creeper nets you at most 2 gunpowder, so, to get a stack of low-powered rockets, you have to kill at least 32 creepers. Getting a stack of 3-gunpowder high-power rockets, the most efficient for flying, takes at least 96 creepers. With a grinder, those numbers are easy to AFK. Going out and killing them takes more effort and involves more risk. One has to hunt the mobs and kill them, which is the point of PvE Minecraft in the first place. Removing creeper spawners would return us to vanilla mechanics for getting gunpowder, and make rockets more risky and time-consuming to create, thus disincentivizing powered elytra travel while preserving their ability to be used. One can always glide around, even without fireworks.

The other method of balancing elytra is to remove the powered flight mechanic. This would return us to rev17-19, when flight towers and mountains provided the only way to get across the map fast. This would not be a popular move with new players, who expect 1.12 mechanics on 1.12 servers. Thus, I would recommend keeping powered flight and removing creeper spawners from the map. 

Whether we keep or remove powered flight, making wings harder to get will also allow us to balance them better than we do now. In vanilla, you can find 5-6 sets of wings in the End cities. That's a small amount of wings that require a good bit of exploring to get to. As it stands, we require an Essence of Flight and a dragon head to get wings. Limiting EoF to flying mobs, instead of all hostile mobs plus flying mobs as it is now, would reduce the amount of wings on the server. So would making the dragon fight harder. I support both of these changes.

 

As for the nether, I think the two-level format we have is an interesting concept that should be continued. It'd be fun to see the glowstone forest make a comeback, as well as the obsidian spires. Those were a lot of fun to explore. It'd be cool to see the End get a similar treatment, with chorus forests and end-stone hills instead of the island we have now. The two-level format makes the nether fun, since you have more options to build and that's never a bad thing.

Golem souls could be used like they were this rev, with a trader at spawn, and I think it'd be worth considering making them tradeable for rare items as part of regular villager trading. We could make 10 souls worth a max enchant pick of some kind, or something like that. If souls are a part of the game, they ought to be integrated into its trading infrastructure in more ways. 

The Knight's Quest has been really successful because it adds a whole new level to the base game. It requires exploring, and abilities ranging from parkour to combat to brainpower. It's a diverse set of quests that aren't overly hard, but still require a lot of tenacity and skill. I think a series of builds in the overworld is a great way to house quests, since they add to the scenery and make the whole map worth exploring. That kind of event will always be fun. As for new ideas, I really like the idea of making the payoff for finishing some hard quest or event have a server-wide effect. We had something like this with Nilrem at spawn this rev, but we can expand on it. Instead of donations, have the event be something like the NITWITS challenges, where the clues/quests/events are integrated into current builds, or create a particularly hard Knights Quest or Trials of Faith/Trials of Sorrow type quest. Anyone who finishes the quest creates a positive outcome for the whole server. We could make this outcome some new special traders at spawn, like this rev, or a slight XP buff for killing certain mobs, or a slightly greater chance of a head dropping from a killed mob, or anything else that anyone can access. The idea is to encourage participation in the quest by making rewards a server-wide thing. 

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