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Congratulations on 100k total server bans

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Wow. Thats like 54 bans per day for 5 years.

Edited by unce
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Where are you seeing the number of bans? I mean this is known as the server everyone's banned from so I almost believe you.

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Uh, thanks. I guess.
 

Where are you seeing the number of bans? I mean this is known as the server everyone's banned from so I almost believe you.

25 bans per page x 4009 pages = 100,225

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Oh gotcha. If I click "last" towards the bottom it brings me back to the mcbouncer front page.

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This is all the MCBouncer server bans, including nerd.nu, not just nerd.nu

 

No it isn't

 

 

EDIT:

 

I think the fact that nerd has more than 100,000 bans after only being open 5 years might mean that we should revisit our banning policy.  Possibly implementing temporary bans?

Edited by roastnewt
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I think the fact that nerd has more than 100,000 bans after only being open 5 years might mean that we should revisit our banning policy.  Possibly implementing temporary bans?

 

I don't. I feel part of the punishment is having to make the ban appeal, having to admit your wrongdoing. If we just set ban lengths that automatically expire, I don't think that causes people to change their ways. Heck, many people who do go through the process refuse to change their ways, but many others do.

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I don't. I feel part of the punishment is having to make the ban appeal, having to admit your wrongdoing. If we just set ban lengths that automatically expire, I don't think that causes people to change their ways. Heck, many people who do go through the process refuse to change their ways, but many others do.

 

It wont cause people to "change their ways". At most, it's a process to prove submission.

 

But yeah, most of those bans were from the time when nerd.nu was one of very few servers, but those days are long gone.

 

If you look at the banning systems for most modern servers, they all lean to the side of tempbans for most things.

 

-gsand

;D

Edited by gsand
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I have to agree with Gsand.

 

The current ban appeal system isn't efficient and makes the player feel they need to beg for forgiveness for a rule violation.

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It wont cause people to "change their ways". At most, it's a process to prove submission.

Your wording seems harsh, but I'm not really seeing this as a counter-argument. We have a set of rules, and we just ask for them to be followed. If they can't, then the ban appeal process is something they have to go through to show they can properly follow instructions. Many of my ban appeals, I required the player to go quote the rule they broke. This required them to not only read the rules, but follow a set of directions given to them to be unbanned. So, is it wrong for people to have to follow the rules to play here?

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Denevien, I think what gsand is getting at is players spend the time to make a forum account, post a ban appeal, and wait for the admin to reply to tell them what they already know.

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I agree, Denevian, when the bans are for major rule breaking.  But don't think of temp-bans as "get out of ban free," think of them as a "time-out."  If someone is being homophobic in chat, or not replanting crops, make them sit in "time-out" for a while, and suggest that they read the rules.  Of course, if it's xray or something, then resort to a ban-until-appeal.

 

Most new players don't know how it works on nerd.  Nerd does it differently than 99.9% of the other servers out there.  A newly banned player just thinks "Wow, I got perm banned for saying 'fag,' they must take the rules extremely seriously.  I can't believe they don't even give you a second chance!"  They see the link to appeal, but don't realize that they can appeal even if they're guilty.  (Most people think "appeal" means "I was banned unfairly," not "ask to come back, even if you were banned for a legitimate reason").

 

This is the story I've heard time and time again, when speaking to players on other servers, is that they tried playing on nerd, but they got perm banned for breaking a few blocks few hundred blocks, so now they're playing on <insert popular server here>.

 

The fact that the vast majority of players never appeal supports this idea.

Edited by roastnewt
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Denevien, I think what gsand is getting at is players spend the time to make a forum account, post a ban appeal, and wait for the admin to reply to tell them what they already know.

Some players claim they haven't read the rules at all, which I find ridiculous since they get a free rule book upon joining each server, and can get it again by /rulebook. In some cases they get banned for something they didn't know existed, and then they make an appeal stating that they don't know what they did.

Even if we explained how appealing a ban works, those people who did get banned and say they didn't know the rules obviously threw that rulebook away when they got it.

I am not sure if here is already a [server] alert saying this but if not, on S, C and P we could put a message saying "Make sure to read the rules before playing, they are avalible at nerd.nu/rules."

Also someone could outline the banning and appeal procedure too and put it in the rulebook, or change the wording of the message you see when you get banned, like "You have been banned, nerd.nu/appeal to bet unbanned!" So they don't think they are permabanned

Edited by coolgamerovr90
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Denevien, I think what gsand is getting at is players spend the time to make a forum account, post a ban appeal, and wait for the admin to reply to tell them what they already know.

What makes you think they already know? Sure we give them a rulebook when they join but that doesn't mean they have read it. I have had far to many encounters where people have not read the rules and get talked to about it by staff or other members. I have seen many instances of racism in chat and other players will "say no racism" and they get the message. That's the point of a ban appeal, they can see what they did wrong and read the rules.

I agree, Denevian, when the bans are for major rule breaking.  But don't think of temp-bans as "get out of ban free," think of them as a "time-out."  If someone is being homophobic in chat, or not replanting crops, make them sit in "time-out" for a while, and suggest that they read the rules.  Of course, if it's xray or something, then resort to a ban-until-appeal.

 

Most new players don't know how it works on nerd.  Nerd does it differently than 99.9% of the other servers out there.  A newly banned player just thinks "Wow, I got perm banned for saying 'fag,' they must take the rules extremely seriously.  I can't believe they don't even give you a second chance!"  They see the link to appeal, but don't realize that they can appeal even if they're guilty.  (Most people think "appeal" means "I was banned unfairly," not "ask to come back, even if you were banned for a legitimate reason").

 

This is the story I've heard time and time again, when speaking to players on other servers, is that they tried playing on nerd, but they got perm banned for breaking a few blocks, so now they're playing on <insert popular server here>.

 

The fact that the vast majority of players never appeal supports this idea.

We don't "ban people for breaking a few blocks." I personally will not ban unless they have done several hundred blocks of grief. If it a few blocks then I give them a friendly reminder to read the rules and that what they have done is not allowed.
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Your wording seems harsh, but I'm not really seeing this as a counter-argument.

I don't understand how it could have possibly been seen in a negative fashion, it's just a description of the process.

 

Many of my ban appeals, I required the player to go quote the rule they broke. This required them to not only read the rules, but follow a set of directions given to them to be unbanned.

Are all those steps completely necessary, they all seem to have the person to resort to begging, and once they've begged enough, they'll be unbanned. That doesn't seem like an efficient process.

 

Relevant: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominance_and_submission

 

So, is it wrong for people to have to follow the rules to play here?

 

Of course not, but that is not what is being discussed here.

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I don't understand how it could have possibly been seen in a negative fashion, it's just a description of the process.

 

Are all those steps completely necessary, they all seem to have the person to resort to begging, and once they've begged enough, they'll be unbanned. That doesn't seem like an efficient process.

 

Relevant: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominance_and_submission

 

 

Of course not, but that is not what is being discussed here.

I fail to see any of this "Dominance and submission" that you guys keep talking about. Is asking someone to read the rules really that "submissive"? They are suppose to read the rules anway, exactly how are we being dominate by asking them to read the rules?
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We don't "ban people for breaking a few blocks." I personally will not ban unless they have done several hundred blocks of grief. If it a few blocks then I give them a friendly reminder to read the rules and that what they have done is not allowed.

 

Then re-read my comment, and replace "few blocks" with "few hundred blocks."  The issue is the same.

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I don't understand how it could have possibly been seen in a negative fashion, it's just a description of the process.

 

Are all those steps completely necessary, they all seem to have the person to resort to begging, and once they've begged enough, they'll be unbanned. That doesn't seem like an efficient process.

 

Relevant: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominance_and_submission

 

 

I agree with what gsand is saying. It feels as if your in a submissive position because you feel like you have to plead for a chance to be unbanned.

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Then re-read my comment, and replace "few blocks" with "few hundred blocks."  The issue is the same.

If someone is griefing hundreds of blocks there only intention was to grief. Now someone could argue that "that's just how they play, they like to destroy stuff." Then what exactly is a temp ban going to do? You ban them for griefing and they go "oh ok I can't destroy stuff." We already know they haven't read the rules as they were griefing, and when there ban gets lifted the only rule there going to know they broke is griefing and they may go break another rule. Might as well temp ban them for breaking that rule as well? Sure you could put a message in the ban message saying to read the rules but that doesn't mean they actually do it. In a ban appeal we can ask them to find the rule they broke which requires them to read all of the rules.
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If someone is griefing hundreds of blocks there only intention was to grief. Now someone could argue that "that's just how they play, they like to destroy stuff." Then what exactly is a temp ban going to do? You ban them for griefing and they go "oh ok I can't destroy stuff." We already know they haven't read the rules as they were griefing, and when there ban gets lifted the only rule there going to know they broke is griefing and they may go break another rule. Might as well temp ban them for breaking that rule as well? Sure you could put a message in the ban message saying to read the rules but that doesn't mean they actually do it. In a ban appeal we can ask them to find the rule they broke which requires them to read all of the rules.

 

The issue that I spoke about was the fact that this system is almost entirely unique to nerd, and new players don't KNOW that's how it works.  They think the ban is permanent, and that the appeals process is like the appeals process in a court of law, i.e., a place to argue their innocence.  Like I said,

 

Nerd does it differently than 99.9% of the other servers out there.  A newly banned player just thinks "Wow, I got perm banned for saying 'fag,' they must take the rules extremely seriously.  I can't believe they don't even give you a second chance!"  They see the link to appeal, but don't realize that they can appeal even if they're guilty.  (Most people think "appeal" means "I was banned unfairly," not "ask to come back, even if you were banned for a legitimate reason").

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The issue that I spoke about was the fact that this system is almost entirely unique to nerd, and new players don't KNOW that's how it works.  They think the ban is permanent, and that the appeals process is like the appeals process in a court of law, i.e., a place to argue their innocence.  Like I said,

 

 

Its the opposite of the judicial system. Instead of "Innocent until proven guilty" its "Guilty until proven innocent".

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